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Author Topic: Problems threading on the lathe  (Read 330075 times)

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Offline Chip

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Re: Problems threading on the lathe
« Reply #270 on: May 01, 2009, 01:24:32 PM »
Hi, Art

Getting very little to no output on scope hear with last 2 Data scope plug-ins.

Chip
« Last Edit: May 01, 2009, 01:26:05 PM by Chip »

Offline ART

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Re: Problems threading on the lathe
« Reply #271 on: May 01, 2009, 01:33:23 PM »
Chip:

 Wow, thats pretty flat a graph..

 Well, what Ive dteermined so far is the "maybe" the CPU clock is varying on some systems. Here is a driver and plugin that uses a whole new method, it uses the PCI bus timer, and all results are displayed in uS, not clocks or ms.

  Id be interested in your results, you have the most stable system Iv eseen yet, even better than mine.. ( a bit. :) )

 This test requires this new driver and plugin..

Art

Offline Chip

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Re: Problems threading on the lathe
« Reply #272 on: May 01, 2009, 02:12:24 PM »
Hi, Art

Hears a pic of the new plug in still no data displayed, I'll try it on my other computer later today.

Pin 10 is assigned to index, Trimming is on pin 11 simulated.

Chip

Offline RICH

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Re: Problems threading on the lathe
« Reply #273 on: May 01, 2009, 02:38:50 PM »
Hi All,
Well no joy here on the graphic display for version 024 or 027.
Tried using the files from reply 264 & 271.
 
Using a 4 slotted disc and timing.
Here is a screen shot using version 027 and using sys file from reply 264.

RICH

Offline RICH

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Re: Problems threading on the lathe
« Reply #274 on: May 01, 2009, 03:30:50 PM »
ART,
I got the graph to work.
Will post some pics and also a file on what did to do to get it to work.

RICH

Offline RICH

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Re: Problems threading on the lathe
« Reply #275 on: May 01, 2009, 05:00:25 PM »
ART,
Here are some pics at various sample rates.
Kernal speed was 25khz and actual spindle speed was 197 RPM.
I also noticed that if you run the driver test first the rpm in the DRO actualy
will change up or down when you load TURN. The plugin  didn't behave very well on my end since one time
I could load a threading program and watch the correction change as it was threading, then it didn't work,
then sometimes it would show 5 slots, then no index based rpm.

BTW, I could only get the graph to display for 32, 64 and 128 samples. If spindle speed was increased
then maybe 16 samples would show. No graph past 128 samples though.

I also attached a file which shows what i did to get the graph to display.

RICH



Offline ART

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Re: Problems threading on the lathe
« Reply #276 on: May 01, 2009, 06:08:14 PM »
Hi Rich:

>>In the directory where MACH3 is installed replace the "sys" file with the one posted
in  reply #271 and also install the threading plug in the reply.
You may also want to create an xml just for testing.

>>>1.Need to go into Windows device manager and uninstall the Mach3 driver

  True..

>> 2.Run Mach's Driver Test and that will install the driver from reply #271

  Prior to this, check the windows folders for a backup of mach3.sys, delte it if it exists, some peopl ehave backups in Windows folders and the old driver gets reinstalled. I think your driver is still old.. Ill make up another with 1.03 as the version..

>>3. In MACH3 TURN: I am using a disc with four slots of which one is at least 50% larger than
    than the others.
   - in config - enable the advanced threading plug in

 YUP, CORRECT.

   - in config>ports and pins>input signals - enable the index and timing using the same ports and pin numbers

  ONLY IF YOU ARE USING INDEX AS A TEST INSTEAD OF SLOTS.

     but the index is checked for emulated ( if you don't enable the index you may not get a graph, may be a fluke?? )

  NOPE< MAKE SURE INDEX IS NOT EMULATED>

   - in config>ports and pins>spindle setup - check spindle feedback and spindle speed averaging

 DOESNT MATTER FOR THE PLUGIN>

4.Open the plug in control pulldown and click on the advanced threading, click the Launch Scope, select # of samples in the
data scope screen and click capture.

 YUP< BUT I THINK YOUR DRIVER IS OLD> NUMBERS ARE WAY WRONG.

 Ill post anew one shortly..

Art

Offline ART

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Re: Problems threading on the lathe
« Reply #277 on: May 01, 2009, 06:13:15 PM »
Hi Guys:

  Here is a newer version, if the driver version box doesnt say 1.03 , then you havent properly loaded the new driver. On some systems you need to do a search of the C:\Windows\.. and deeper folders to make sure no Mach3.sys exists, delete it if it does, then follow the install of the driver as per normal using drivertest.

 This may be the last till I return from vacation, I leave tomorrow for a week. Be back sunburned and ready to finalize all this rpm testing.. The numbers Chip and Rich are getting seem wrong, and I suspect the driver isnt updating or something, or that the PCI bus timer is too large to fir in 32 bits. Mine does, but I may need to make it take 64 bit values into account.

Thx,
Art

Offline ART

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Re: Problems threading on the lathe
« Reply #278 on: May 01, 2009, 06:42:15 PM »
Hi Guys:

  Heres a photo of my system running test program just uploaded. Ill explain the numbers a bit as well.

Notice the Driver version is 1.03, if yours isnt, your driver didnt load, an older one did.

Notice RPM is about 394.6RPM, 101 slots, slot time is about 1505uS , thats the time from slot to slot. With 100 slots , that woudl be
394.74 approx, so thats pretty good. ( for the math oriented.. the calc is ...)

  1 slot time is .001505 , times 101 slots is .152005 seconds per 101 slots, and if we look to the reciprical, 1/.152005 is 6.5787 revs per second, times 60 is 394.74 RPM..  :)

 Note the index time ( time from one index to another is 152347.3us or .152347 seconds.. much liek the above calc from there..

 Interrupt time is the time from int to int. Its about 21.8uS , ( .0000218 seconds) whic when you divide into 1 second is 45800hz ( my kernal speed at the moment..).

 101 slots is how many slots it sees in the TIMING input from one INDEX input to the next..

Main PCI timer base is the speed of your PCI timer, on mine its about 3579545 counts per second. This timer value on a system is documented not to change and be very accurate, its why Im switching to this method. Your number may be similar or not, the program will take this into account.

Your cpu(s) shoudl show your cpu Throttling is disabled.

If TIMING input is disabled, then encoder #3 is used as the counter. If you try a G32 motion, the Q is a quality value, it will show 1.00 if the speed doesnt change after the thread starts. It lowers (?) or raises if it slows or speeds up. In the end this value will determine how much slower the motors move.

Slot based RPM is based on a 64 slot average time, whcih should be pretty stable, but if your fooling it with just a TIMING input set to the same pin as
your INDEX< then you will have to make sure the spindle rotates 64 times before this stabiizes. Threading lock RPM is the speed locked in at start of G32 mode to set the master reference speed.

 Index based RPM is the RPM based on INDEX to INDEX input only so you can see if the slots are more accurate.

 Last Index Time is simply the time in uS from one INDEX pulse to another..

 Last SLOT is the non-averaged last slot time.

 The Corr BAR is a visual display of how much the spindle has slowed or sped up since G32 started.

You can test all this by zeroing your Z axis, and simply entering G32Z0 , youll then be in G32 mode, and the Q and Corr bar
will activate. Entering a G0 in MDI will cancel G32 mode.

 In the Scope:

   I havent yet relabeled the Y axis to uS from ms, so ignore that, its all in uS..

Youll notice on mine that the high is 1517uS or .001517 seconds between pulses.. and low is .001494, so the range is only .000013 seconds or so, thats
very stable indeed.About  1 interrupt time. ( 23us or so..).

 The variance from low to high on the scope should really never exceed 1 interrupt time in normal operation. If it does, somethign is varying, ( and thats what Im searchign for. )


Im using my normal INDEX from my lathe, and feeding in a set frequency to my TIMING input from my new PMDX-112 testing baord. ( I love this thing.. :) )

So the slots are simulated, but with a very stable frequency. This way I eliiminate outside causes of loss of timing.

 Thats it. Have fun, post pictures, if they are screwed up, not to worry, I may need to change to a lager number handler. Your PCI time may exceed
32 bits. I didnt think it would, it woudl mean a PCI timer running at higher than 4,294,967,295 hz.. 4Ghz would be one high speed timer. :)

  As you can see there a fairt amount of design here to show as much as I can get, I really want to find any loss of timing and where it is at. This is the first time Ive used the PCI timer, but as I say, its known to be very stable, so if we can get all this working, your feedrates and such will become more accurate as
I use this timer for other things, pulse counts, feedrate measurments, timign statistics in DriverTest..ect..

Just thought Id explain whats going on in allthis in case it helps in your playing.

Thx for the testing.
Art


 

  

Offline ART

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Re: Problems threading on the lathe
« Reply #279 on: May 01, 2009, 06:43:03 PM »
LOL, forgot the phot.. too much typing.. LOL

Here it is..

Art