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Author Topic: New setup for USB board by BSMCEO4U-PP Bitsensor  (Read 24069 times)

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Re: New setup for USB board by BSMCEO4U-PP Bitsensor
« Reply #20 on: January 15, 2021, 11:05:13 AM »
MF2D
You asked: "does this board support threading (does the index support signal)?"

I'm not quite sure what you mean. by threading or signal. Please expand on your thought.
One thing, I wish I had the source code of the processor and the RNR driver.
Bill
Re: New setup for USB board by BSMCEO4U-PP Bitsensor
« Reply #21 on: January 15, 2021, 11:43:13 AM »


I'm not quite sure what you mean. by threading or signal.

I meant the following: when using Mach3 with a lathe, Mach3 requires a signal index for threading. When using the LPT - port index, the signal is sent to the Index input, and the actual spindle revolutions are displayed in the STrue window. I gave an index signal to the input, but the mach does not respond to it. so my guess is that this feature is simply not supported. And it is impossible to cut threads on a lathe with this board. But maybe someone was still able to achieve this.
Re: New setup for USB board by BSMCEO4U-PP Bitsensor
« Reply #22 on: January 15, 2021, 12:36:17 PM »
Hi,
single point lathe threading is a process that is enacted by a realtime motion controller.

The spindle index signal not only provides a pulse for the controller to work out the spindle speed, which
is in turn displayed by Mach, but it needs it to synchronize the z axis so repeated cuts of the same thread
are in the same 'groove'.

Mach alone cannot do that. The communication delay between the index signal (as presented to the controller)
and Mach receiving it will be several milliseconds at least. Mach would then have to decide when to move
the Z axis and communicate that back to the controller, another several milliseconds of delay, and that command
has to propagate through the motion buffer, maybe several hundred milliseconds more delay. The combined delay
means that all synchronization is lost.

Mach's original motion controller was the parallel port, and the parallel port driver was and is a very clever attempt
to have a Windows PC (a non realtime computing system) enact a realtime controller. Not withstanding its quirks
and limitations it does pretty well, to whit it makes a fair job of single point lathe threading. That means that the
parallel port could receive an index pulse and the port driver could calculate the exact instant that Z axis movement
need to commense and issue the pulses to the Z axis driver at that instant. It didn't have to refer to Mach, like
the 'general manager upstairs'........it could do it immediately, or realtime.

If instead of using Machs parallel port driver (as motion controller) you use an external motion controller, and in this
thread, the RnR/Bitsensor board it is the external board that must synchronize the cutting, and to my knowledge
the RnR/Bitsensor board does not have that capacity.

Craig
My wife left with my best friend...
     and I miss him!
Re: New setup for USB board by BSMCEO4U-PP Bitsensor
« Reply #23 on: January 15, 2021, 10:36:55 PM »
Hi,
As far as I can tell, The switch inputs IN1 to IN4 are passed directly to Mach3, and then handed back to the controller as needed. That said, some time passes in those transfers. The index signal can be tried, but I wouldn't know if it will work for you. The spindle speed is relatively slow when tapping so signal time may not be a big issue. It will depend on speed, response time, and how much slop you can tolerate.
Many VFDs have an incredible set of options that could perform whatever operations you plan. Unfortunately, if the manual isn't in English those features can get lost.
Bill
Re: New setup for USB board by BSMCEO4U-PP Bitsensor
« Reply #24 on: January 15, 2021, 10:59:07 PM »
Hi,

Quote
The switch inputs IN1 to IN4 are passed directly to Mach3, and then handed back to the controller as needed

Incorrect, the index signal must be processed immediately. If Mach 'hands it back' the instructions have to propagate through the
motion buffer, hundreds of milliseconds delay........way WAY too slow to synchronize threading.

There was  very extensive discussions about this on the forum 10 years or so ago when external motion controller manufacturers were
trying to get their devices to support single point lathe threading.

Craig
My wife left with my best friend...
     and I miss him!
Re: New setup for USB board by BSMCEO4U-PP Bitsensor
« Reply #25 on: January 16, 2021, 07:14:51 AM »
and to my knowledge
the RnR/Bitsensor board does not have that capacity.

Craig

Thanks Craig for the info!
Somehow I expected ...

Marat
Re: New setup for USB board by BSMCEO4U-PP Bitsensor
« Reply #26 on: January 16, 2021, 08:01:49 PM »
Hi,
the only thing to recommend RnR/BitSenor motion control boards is their price.

They do work despite the dearth of published information and confusing pin numbering system but they have never
supported G31 probing, single point threading or hardware THC.

If you want or need any of those realtime supports then you need a different controller period.

If you want a more capable and better supported external motion board then you should chose an Ethernet connected device
being much more noise immune and lower latency. An Ethernet SmoothStepper or a 57CNC has all the realtime supports
listed above.

Craig
My wife left with my best friend...
     and I miss him!
Re: New setup for USB board by BSMCEO4U-PP Bitsensor
« Reply #27 on: January 18, 2021, 06:13:20 PM »
Hi two things,
As far as I know, the Bitsensor board is compatible with Mach4. It just doesn't have a manual for saying how.
Second:
I just updated my user guide for the BSMCEO4U. New name and new link. I have identical web pages on two different home servers in attempt for 100% up time. One in Chicago and the other in Rock Island, IL  (see cnc.vancura.biz and cnc.vancura-innovations.com)

http://shoelessdave.com/Vancura.Innovations/files/BSMCEO4U%20Install%20Manual-converted%20wjv%202.2.pdf

http://vancura.biz/files/BSMCEO4U%20Install%20Manual-converted%20wjv%202.2.pdf

It is in effect a full translation from the Chinese version of the manual. I put some serious time into it trying to make American English out of it. I added a few more installation diagrams and some more documentation on the ports.

What it needs now is a Mach4 addendum.  I personally don't plan to go to Mach4, but anyone willing to document their frustrations in setting it up, will be welcome to send me the procedure for publishing.
Bill


Hi,

Just to add a note of thanks. Very useful document.
One of the areas I struggled with for setup information was the ability to implement the gantry squaring function, I basically have two ballscrews used on a X and A axis. (Slaved)
I was keen to implement the independent homing of the the X and A with home switches and the benefit this gives keeping the gantry square.
So just a note to say it is possible with this card but I could not find any details on how to do it.
In summary I did the following :-

I had to remove the E-Stop function on the card Input. (I have another hardware method to cover this)

Used a dedicated X-axis home switch on input 1
Used a dedicated A-axis home switch on input 4
The Y and Z axis home switches wired in parallel to input 3
X,Y,Z, A limit switches are all wired in parallel to input 2

I also managed to keep the probe function by using this on Input 4. I was pleased to keep this function.

So my trade off is the removal of E-Stop input to the card that I cover with a hardwired system.

I edited the 'Ref All Home Button' script to the following.

DoButton( 24 )
DoButton( 23 )
RefCombination( 9 )
DoOEMButton(133)
DoOEMButton(134)
DoOEMButton(135)

So to clarify, now when I press this button the system will move the Z-axis to the top until the home switch is made, then it backs off and retracts very slowly to make the switch with more precision and zeros the axis. Then it moves to repeat this for the Y axis.

Finally it will then drive both my X and A axis at the same time until one of the X or A home switches is made. it then will stop on first switch made, do the retraction and Zero, and then drive the opposite axis to complete the squaring process.

Quite pleased overall with this basic low cost card for my needs.

Hopefully that info might be useful for someone trying to implement gantry squaring.

(There may be better methods but I could not find any information)

Cheers


 
Re: New setup for USB board by BSMCEO4U-PP Bitsensor
« Reply #28 on: January 18, 2021, 07:24:13 PM »
Hi,
As you have discovered, you can merge switch inputs. Home and Limit switches may be one and the same (works for me). This could give you an extra input for a dedicated E-Stop.   
The inputs you have on Input#3 are somewhat redundant with the ones on Input #2.
I don't have a second motor for X, so I was unaware you could home both slaved motors separately while slaved together.
I also use a slightly modified RefAllHome button. 
One thing that the BSM board won't do is jog X & Y at the same time. The Parallel port interface allows this and I miss it occasionally.
Bill