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RYE router Retrofit
« on: March 31, 2013, 04:53:48 PM »
 I am going to use the CSMIO/IP A to retrofit my router, and i would like to share this project from the begin to the end with other persons
My object if is to do the more possible by myself, and i hop it will be helpful for other.

If you think i am posting a the wrong place, feel free to let me know.
Please  apologize me for my English mistake  i am a French dyslexic


I am a 32 years hold wood worker living in Belgium and i Try to Sarto a little bu sines with nested based furniture's.
 
Few years ago i discover on youtube the  cnc machine and from that day, my mind about my job complexly change.
After a long research about how to Build one by myself, i have choose to go for a retrofit.
So, the 01/01/2010  at  00h04 i win my bid on ebay for an 2550x1550mm table size gantry cnc router.

The machine is a 1993  Rye MG2420  gantry router build in England with a Bosch cc100 control er and Bosch servodyn ac servo.
After a big hole in my workshop roof and a giant crane to move the 6000 kg from my neighbours lane, the retrofit job start !

In  first i try to go with Linux EMC2  and Mesa board but it was not possible for me to get some help with Linux and mesa board.
After one year i stop with Emc2 and get  a professional one man company in France specialized with cnc retrofit.
The man develop and build his own softwar and motion controle board working in analogue close loop controle.
The price was affordable for me, about 1250€ for the motion controle system and 40€/h for the job on the machine......
That was the  perfect dream, until work delay .. And.. Delay again, .. Electronic card wont work....  with a very bad after sale service, and a this time the  job is  not done.

So, because i always look the half full glass insted of the half empty, all that past experience learnt me a lot and i feel glad to understand how it work !

But en ought talking, let's go in the fact:

I have, in working order condition :

The complete electrical drawing
Al the documentation for all component

Bosch AC servo drive , SM drive an VM power module.  +/- 10v. Anal.  Encoder
Hsd electro spindle es919 C axis  7 kw iso30
Yaskawa inverter 7,5 kw
Mitsubishi ac servo 200 w for the c axis  
Mitsubishi drive MR-J2S-A20.   +/- 10v. Anal. Encoder
Pnoz
380-220v power supply. ( Spindle fan, Mitsubishi drive )
380-110v power supply. ( Contactor, solenoid )
380-24v power supply  ( aux )
380-24v power supply ( motion controller )

Input

Cycle start
Cycle stop
Vacuum start stop
Dust extration start stop
Spindle clockwise
Spindle counter clockwise
Axis fault
C axis fault
Spindle Inverter fault
X home
Y home
Z home
C axis index
X limite
X limite
Y limite
Y limite
Z limite
Z limite
Hsd Push button tool ejection
Hsd sensor tool locked
Hsd sensor tool ejected
Hsd sensor speed 0
Tool holder magazine parking position  sensor
Tool holder magazine out sensor
Dust shoes up sensor
Dust shoes down sensor
Air supply pressure Stop
Stop

Output


power on  ( contactor for spindle inverter and drive )
Stop
Vacuum pump contactor
Dust extration contactor
Spindle  start stop   clockwise
Spindle start stop  counter clockwise
Axis enable
C axis enable
Hsd  tool ejection
Hsd  solenoid valve
Dust shoes vacuum  solenoid valve
Tool holder magazine solenoid valve


Stop loop. ( Pnoz )

X Y Z limite switch
Spindle, and drive contactor
Mushroom stop x 6
Spindle fault
Hsd thermal switch
Motion control


So i believed the CS- lab product will fit perfectly for my need, i am waiting email answer for me them before to order the controller.
Any advise and future help will be welcome.
 And if some of you use a CSMIO/IP  and could share a wiring machine diagram,  it will help me a lot.


 Happy Easter.

Mael.


Sorry again for my spelling mystakes.

« Last Edit: March 31, 2013, 04:57:14 PM by Joyeuxmael »

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Re: RYE router Retrofit
« Reply #1 on: April 01, 2013, 11:02:29 AM »
I think you will like the CSMIO/IP-A and it sounds like it will be a perfect candidate for your machine.
 I have the IP-S on a wee lathe and the IP-A on a Chiron FZ12S VMC  and I think the A is the better choice if your drives can accept analogue control voltages. Both are excellent controllers but the IP-A just has some nice advantages over the IP-S
Look forward to seeing your progress.
Oh also I think it will likely be a holiday in Poland today so you may not hear back until tomorrow at the earliest, I know they are very busy with things at the moment.

Normally you would do your build thread in the Show n tell  section but I dont suppose anyone will worry too much about you doing it here.

Hood
Re: RYE router Retrofit
« Reply #2 on: April 03, 2013, 08:56:36 AM »
Hello,


I have received the Cs-lab reply, they can ship the csmio/ip-A within 3 day.
so i will soon order.

i have start the cabinet job retrofit, i am  Lucky to have plenty of space inside ! ( less outside )

what are the advantage of the  csmio/MPG module instead of a USB pendant ?

Hood, i have read you discussion about the MR-J2S-xxA  servo drive, i will use one for my C axis spindle with the anal 10v signal,  you are very helpfull on this forum,
i have plenty questions in my head but i don't want to harass you, so  it s up to you.


at the moment i am thinking about the main control panel

Power supply ON.   ( computer start ; 24v csmio ; 24v drive and safety component ) 
Power supply OFF
----------------------------------------------------------------
Drive power ON--OFF ( spindle vfd , axis xyz, axis c,  spindle fan )
CSMIO  Input  / Output  same push button
Vacuum ON--OFF
CSMIO  Input  / Output  same push button
Dust Ext ON--OFF
CSMIO  Input  / Output  same push button
-----------------------------------------------------------
Cycle start
CSMIO  Input
Cycle stop ( feed hold )
CSMIO  Input
Rewind  ( to replay the same Code )
CSMIO  Input
Over limite travel  ( key switch )
CSMIO  Input
------------------------------------------------------------

then i will do the E-stop loop

Pnoz 1 =  XYZ axis  limit switch  and 6 X emergency mushroom
CSMIO  Input
cut all the power supply 24V 110V 220V 380V  except the computer mach3 running

Pnoz 2 = air pressure, power coil contactor, axis drive fault, spindle fault, csmio and computer mach3 fault
CSMIO  Input  / Output
drive disable, spindle stop, feed hold move .


i am a bit confused for the E-stop strategy, because if i cut  the main power on my VFD  ( yaskawa 616G5 ) the spindle coast to stop.
maybe a timer to cut the VFD power after 5 second
so i will continue to think about....

good afternoon

Mael

Offline Hood

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Re: RYE router Retrofit
« Reply #3 on: April 03, 2013, 04:00:18 PM »
I am not too familiar with VFD's as I use servos for spindles. Is there an enable signal on it? could maybe take that away.
What is the proz? I did a google and it seems to be a safety relay but there seem to be quite a few so didnt look up the specs of them. Does it have a timer relay section on it?
Hood

Offline Hood

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Re: RYE router Retrofit
« Reply #4 on: April 03, 2013, 04:55:16 PM »
Sorry forgot to answer your question regarding the MPG Module. I much prefer the way the CSMIO module works than the way Mach works. At the moment Mach3 has 3 modes for MPG, Velocity, Multistep and step . On my other machines that dont have a CSMIO controller I use Velocity and multistep modes, they work reasonably well but when compared to the CSMIO they are not as good. The CSMIO uses a similar method to industrial controls, ie x10 x100 x1000 (for metric) and it is very easy to move in exact steps and motion is good. The later plugins have not had quite as good motion as the earlier ones but I have been in contact with Wotjek at  CS-Lab and they are going to be testing it in the next plugin which should be due for release shortly.
Mach4 will be employing this method of MPG control so possibly a USB or even direct to CSMIO controller MPG may work as well but I think the MPG module will still have the advantage.

 Also meant to mention that you are best to have seperate home switches for each axis as that way you can take advantage of the very precise Index homing that the CSMIO/IP-A can do. It will move to the switch then back off slowly then once the switch closes it will then seek out the encoders index pulse and set that as home position.

Hood

Re: RYE router Retrofit
« Reply #5 on: April 04, 2013, 04:57:40 AM »
I ave found a  safety relay with a delay for the spindle FVD, so in case of emergency a stop signal will be send then x seconder after the power will be cut.

My machine is fitted with tow safety, tow limit, and one home switch by axis, so the SCMIO many input  will be helpful here.
For the Output i already have 3x 8  relays board on din rail to control the contactor and the solenoid vales.

About the MPG pendant i will see in the future. In my case because the machine is 3,5 x 1,5 m on the floor i  need a pendant about 5 m long

About the future Mach4 soft,  the CSMIO/IP-A-S  should be compatible with the right plug in an firmwar ?

Actually  i am working on the paper with  the CSMIO strategy / implementation / machine wiring diagram.
I am very proud of my self each time i solved a problem, and the Hood answer are always waiting like a child for the Santa Claus to come.

So thank you again.

It s a shame but my ipad wont rename the picture so i c ant upload JPG !!!

Mael

Offline Hood

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Re: RYE router Retrofit
« Reply #6 on: April 04, 2013, 07:48:57 AM »
Ok you wont need the safety switches as all you need are the limits and homes. You can connect each axes home switch in series with each other so you only need 1 input for them but have the home switches separate for each axis.

You could also if you wished use the extra switches for disabling your servo drives if you wanted but likely that wouldnt be necessary.

You can use your own pendant with the enc module, assuming of course that it has standard type of I/O, ie it is wired and not via USB or ethernet.

Hood
Re: RYE router Retrofit
« Reply #7 on: April 04, 2013, 09:17:26 AM »
The point is my servo can delivery about 9N/m of torque and the Z gantry is about  1000 kg with rapid moove at 15m/mn  so if the machine go crazy the over limit switch connected  to the Safety-relay will save money !!!

Here is a link of a machine like mine.    http://youtu.be/59fyPL8eo6E

For my machine axis  limits switch's i have 3 possibility using the CSMIO input

6 input   (X+)  (X-)  (Y+)  (Y-)  (Z+)  (Z-)
3 input   (X+ X-)  (Y+ Y-)  (Z+ Z-)
1 input  ( X+ X- Y+ Y- Z+ Z-)

Is there an inconvenient with one of those strategy

Thanks,

Mael.
Re: RYE router Retrofit
« Reply #8 on: April 04, 2013, 10:40:17 AM »
For people like me having  their  brain smoking by retrofiting an industrial CNC machine

You can watch this video, solving a  problem could be worst than a cnc ..... http://biertijd.com/mediaplayer/?itemid=40360

Offline Hood

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Re: RYE router Retrofit
« Reply #9 on: April 04, 2013, 01:21:33 PM »
I wasnt meaning to not have limit switches, what I was meaning was additional safety switches which is what I was presuming you were meaning. ie home switch, safety switch then limit switch.

The way I would do it is all 3 axes limits wired in series and all 3 axes home switches as separates. Wouldnt really matter if you put all limits in as individual inputs but there is no real benefit to doing it that way. It would also make wiring in an override switch easier as you would only require a single pole switch to do that.
Hood