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Lots of Questions- ac servo spindle, macros, and tool changing
« on: December 05, 2018, 09:19:44 PM »
The forum search is currently down so I don't know if these topics have been covered (I'm sure they have).

I have a Daewoo Puma 6 that was built in 1984. It was working well up to a few days ago, there is a EPROM issue and I'm trying to track down a way to have new chips burned. Fanuc is telling me that I need to get the chips from the manufacturer of the machine, not the controller. I am thinking I would like to change the system over to Mach. I currently run Mach3 on my CNC router and have been very happy with it.

Current setup on the lathe-
Fanuc 6T Control
12 position tool turret (hydraulic driven with encoder)
Foot operated drawbar and tailstock

My concerns:

The spindle is a 15hp ac servo. There is nothing wrong with the servo drive but I am not sure how to go about controlling it. I do a fair amount of threading so this is important.

X and Z are both Fanuc dc servos, same as my router. I feel I can look at them as a reference for the lathe.

Tool changer and macros...

I need to be able to run a program start to finish with the ability for the machine to change tools. How is this accomplished?

I'm hoping there are a couple individuals out there that can give me some guidance on this or point me to someone that can.

Thanks,

Erik


Re: Lots of Questions- ac servo spindle, macros, and tool changing
« Reply #1 on: December 06, 2018, 12:56:06 AM »
Hi,
depending on the details of the servos then you will need a analogue controller. There are not many choices.

Kanalog
CSMIO/A
HiCon Integra
Gallil- various models.

All of these work with Mach3. The Gallil and Hicon work with Mach4 and the CSMIO/A is supposed to but their Mach4 plugin is buggy.
My advice is consider Mach4.....all development ceased on Mach3 five years ago and eventually it will tip over...so...'go mad now and beat the rush'

Craig
My wife left with my best friend...
     and I miss him!
Re: Lots of Questions- ac servo spindle, macros, and tool changing
« Reply #2 on: December 06, 2018, 06:49:26 AM »
Hi,
depending on the details of the servos then you will need a analogue controller. There are not many choices.

Kanalog
CSMIO/A
HiCon Integra
Gallil- various models.

All of these work with Mach3. The Gallil and Hicon work with Mach4 and the CSMIO/A is supposed to but their Mach4 plugin is buggy.
My advice is consider Mach4.....all development ceased on Mach3 five years ago and eventually it will tip over...so...'go mad now and beat the rush'

Craig

Thanks Craig. How do I determine whether it's running digital or analog? DC servos are yellow cap, a 5M and a 10M.
Re: Lots of Questions- ac servo spindle, macros, and tool changing
« Reply #3 on: December 06, 2018, 07:20:04 AM »
Hi,
I'm sorry but I am unfamiliar with Fanuc servos so can't answer your question.

Craig
My wife left with my best friend...
     and I miss him!
Re: Lots of Questions- ac servo spindle, macros, and tool changing
« Reply #4 on: December 15, 2018, 08:16:27 PM »
Hi Craig
Need your help
I use AC minas servo motor MSD ********* for spindle motor (ECut board) mach3mill..
How to control speed spindle by mach3mill(Wiring diagram) etc?

Thanks
Cari
Re: Lots of Questions- ac servo spindle, macros, and tool changing
« Reply #5 on: December 15, 2018, 08:56:42 PM »
Hi,
I haven't used Mach3 for nearly three years having migrated to Mach4. Having said that the similarities between the two should
be sufficient for you to implement a strategy in Mach3.

The first consideration is whether you require your spindle to be capable of  coordinated motion. This would be required for
rigid tapping. Coordinated motion requires not only velocity control but position control. Position control can be achieved with analogue
controllers as I posted earlier....but at some extra cost and complexity.

Given that your motor is a servo it can of course be operated in step/direction mode to achieve position control. This would mean that you don't
require one of the more expensive analogue controllers. I am unsure of the exact details of how you implement step/direction control for a spindle in Mach3.
I am more familiar with the idea in Mach4. The trick here is that a free running spindle, which is its normal mode of operation would require a step
signal accumulator of infinite size so the spindle can keep rotating without numerical overflow. A position controlled spindle for rigid tapping might only
rotate 20 turns in one direction and then unwind the same 20 turns in the other direction. I have got my high torque spindle to do this, its an Allen Bradley
1.8kW servo motor.

It took considerable effort to get both modes of operation to work, namely the free running spindle mode and the 'C axis' mode. Guess what....I don't
really use it. Because it was possible I thought I would do it only to find it was pretty much a waste of time. Sound familiar? It happens to me quite a bit.
99.999% of the time all I require is a free running spindle. This is much simpler and I would recommend it as a first step in your spindle control
evolution.

In Mach4 there is the possibility to have a free running spindle running in step/direction mode. No extra hardware required. Just fill in the required settings
and  away it goes. If memory serves Mach3 can do the same, see the attached pic.

Another choice that achieves the same result is to use the servo in analogue mode. Just about all AC servos allow the possibility to use a +10V to -10V
analogue voltage to control the speed of the servo. In which case you can use an AC servo in a manner very similar to a VFD controlled induction motor.

Thus you have two choices to control a free running spindle with an AC servo:
1) Free running step/direction mode as provided by Mach
2) Analogue voltage control using Mach and your BoB to produce the control voltage  and program your drive to be analogue velocity controlled.

If you require either an indexing spindle or a coordinated motion spindle that's a whole bunch harder. Would recommend you stay away from this until
you have had some experience controlling your spindle in free running mode....then maybe think about it!

Craig
My wife left with my best friend...
     and I miss him!