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Re: 3020T and Win10 64 bit
« Reply #10 on: April 07, 2015, 07:28:45 AM »
Hi all,
I've been researching Windows and in particular what it takes to write a driver. The more I get into it the more I'm impressed that Art was able to write anything which works let alone
works as well as it does.
A lot of the kernel API's have never been documented by MS in the first place and I'm buggered if I can see a way of making working code with what they have published.
I even gave some thought to using a realtime operating system like RTX. RTX runs one (or more) cores as ordinary windows but runs one (upto 31) cores as a realtime scheduler in one multicore cpu.
A Win app like Mach can communicate with the realtime core/cores with shared memory. Great idea, Windows doesn't interfere with the realtime core at all and you have control
of interrupts/busses/timers and so on. In some respects its a bit like how a smoothstepper works namlely that Mach, the trajectory controller, passes instructions via USB/Ethernet
to an FPGA to handle pulse timing. The same thing could be done with RTX but the pulse generation is handled by a gen purpose cpu by software rather than an FPGA in firmware.

Downside is that from what I hear RTX is expensive and they would scarce answer my emails let alone sell to me, altogether to much like MS!!!!

Craig

Anyway I have yet to find the outer limits of what the existing PP can achieve and don't believe that it would be much better in 64bit even if it were possible. As for people who insist
that it should I wonder if that means that if they bought a Ferrari they would want a towbar fitted so they can plough a paddock?
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Re: 3020T and Win10 64 bit
« Reply #11 on: April 24, 2015, 12:40:14 PM »
Hi.  this is my first post and I have to admit that I haven't read the entire forum yet but this 64 bit thing is news to me.  I have been trying to figure out why MACH3 isn't seeing my new parallel port I have installed on a Win 7 64 bit OS.  This must be why.  One would think that the fact that MACH3 will not work on a 64 bit computer would have been prominently mentioned on the download page...

I guess I will go see if I can find an XP disk - did that come on a 3-1/2 inch floppy or a 6" floppy?

John

Offline ger21

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Re: 3020T and Win10 64 bit
« Reply #12 on: April 24, 2015, 01:36:32 PM »
It's listed under the Requirements.
http://www.machsupport.com/software/mach3/#tabs-4
Gerry

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Re: 3020T and Win10 64 bit
« Reply #13 on: April 24, 2015, 04:47:22 PM »
My bad - there it is...  No integrated graphic card either... 

Hummm...  I will have to rethink this whole thing.

Thanks for the input.
John

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Re: 3020T and Win10 64 bit
« Reply #14 on: April 24, 2015, 05:58:52 PM »
You can use an external motion controller and still use your 64bit OS. Something like the UC100 is only $120. A Pokeys is even cheaper I think.
Gerry

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Re: 3020T and Win10 64 bit
« Reply #15 on: April 25, 2015, 03:53:28 AM »
Hi all,
my controller OS is Windows 7 Embedded Standard (WES7) 32 bit and it works flawlessly. I have seen posts where people have given up on Windows 7, I can't comment because I don't
have a copy of the retail version of Windows 7, I do however have a runtime license for WES7.
The 'embedded' version of Windows 7 is a modularised version of the retail version. You can select those modules required to run your device/controller and leave all the other junk
out. Windows XP Embedded was similar but to configure the 15000 components it included is a real mission. By comparison to XP Embedded WES7 is a breeze, it has some templates
like compataility mode that results in a full blown OS similar if not identical to retail Windows 7. Otherwise you can make up your own installation mix by choosing from a 100 or so
modules. The installation software checks for conflicts and missing essential modules, all in all not too bad to do.
Microsoft allow a free download of WES7 and the required installation tools. In absence of registering with Microsoft it runs in demo mode for a month, if you register it runs for six months,
easily time enough for anyone to determine if it is any good. Getting a runtime license is a little bit more complicated and expensive but I found more than worth the effort, I suppose
you could install a fresh OS every six months and then it would be free if inconvenient.
The full download is about 6gig but the 32bit distribution share and IBW the manual install tool is about 3 gig. I downloaded the complete package which includes the 64 bit distribution
share and ICE the automated installation tool. I never used either the 64 bit DS or ICE, I had only my own system to configure so ICE seems pointless for me and I still use PP so
didn't need/want 64 bit.
I burnt a disc with the 32 bit DS and IBW and installed it on my platform in a couple of hours and first six months free, thanks Microsoft!
I never had to shag about with drivers and all that stuff as it ran on my new platform straight from the box. I have since installed a PCI parallel card and driver for a second port
and obviously Mach3 and my favourite plugins and have been cutting chips ever since. The parallel port driver of Mach3 runs better at 100k than my old XP machine did at 25K.
I recommend WES7 to anyone. I believe the retail Windows 7 has so much network and internet security junk in it that Mach3 struggles with all the intrusion, WES7 does not.
My wife left with my best friend...
     and I miss him!
Re: 3020T and Win10 64 bit
« Reply #16 on: April 25, 2015, 09:42:48 AM »
Have you tried it with M4?
Do you have a list of which modules are required by M3 or M4

It sounds like an interesting way to simplify.

BAR
Re: 3020T and Win10 64 bit
« Reply #17 on: April 26, 2015, 12:03:52 AM »
Hi,
I have yet to try M4 but imagine it will run under any well configured Windows OS.

M3 is not a particularly hungry program, it will run on a single core @1Ghz with 500M of ram. I have yet to see a post which concludes that it runs better on multicore
64 bit platforms.

It is certainly true that the PP pulse engine will only run on 32 bit systems of Windows 7 or earlier. Further it is not processing power that determines whether PP
runs well or not but whether the OS and background software is optimised so that the interrupt driven PP timer can run without excess jitter. I suspect the reason
an independent video card is required is that such a card reduces the number of interrupts the CPU has to respond to. My platform is a dual core Intel Atom and
it has an on chip GPU that shares memory with the CPU's, not per recommendation and yet works better than my XP machine did with a dedicated graphics card.
The Atom is a reasonably recent design and the interrupt load on the CPU's by the GPU is low.

Increasing numbers of users are migrating to external motion controllers and thereby markedly reducing the significance of the OS and background software. I am still
happy with PP to date....

As to the required modules for a working OS I would recommend 'The Professionals Guide to Windows 7 Embedded Standard' by Sean Liming. It explains most of the
modules and its installation. A lot of the book details automated installs appropriate for a manufacturer but of less relevance to you or I but is still useful.
One option is to use the 'compatability mode' template and the resultant OS looks almost identical to retail Windows 7. It seems to work fine. My current install
however is a custom install and the major components left out are internet explorer, media player and network security modules. If you are interested I will endeavour
to show the selection page I used, it is not recorded as such because it runs in WnPE the installation environment but it is not too scary.

I am no great fan of Microsoft but have to say that the free download and trial conditions are good. I was able to purchase a runtime key for $200 NZ, about $130 US
and I think petty good value.

Craig
My wife left with my best friend...
     and I miss him!

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Re: 3020T and Win10 64 bit
« Reply #18 on: June 12, 2016, 08:44:15 AM »
Hey guys. I have Windows 7 x 64 bit with Mach 3 installed and a warp9 ESS Smooth stepper. The ESS is communicating (According to their documentation with the LED's) but i can't get the stepper motors to jog. Fair warning, I am a ground zero noob.

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Re: 3020T and Win10 64 bit
« Reply #19 on: June 13, 2016, 03:12:41 AM »
Hey guys. I have Windows 7 x 64 bit with Mach 3 installed and a warp9 ESS Smooth stepper. The ESS is communicating (According to their documentation with the LED's) but i can't get the stepper motors to jog. Fair warning, I am a ground zero noob.


Perhaps goto the Warp9 site (http://www.warp9td.com/index.php/sw) check that you are using their recommended version of Mach3 and their lastest plugin. Download and run their SCU and follow the onscreen instructions (there is also a video showing how to use the SCU, if required).

Hope this helps.

Tweakie.
Success consists of going from failure to failure without loss of enthusiasm.  Winston Churchill.