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Author Topic: Slot cuting wizard by Brian/Kran  (Read 7848 times)

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Slot cuting wizard by Brian/Kran
« on: March 29, 2014, 09:47:47 PM »
Not sure if this is where I should ask this question, but I didn't see a place for general wizard questions.

I'm trying to cut 4 slots in a piece of mild steel to make a motor mount.  I ran across the slot cutting wizard in the subject of this message.  I was going to set it up 4 times to get all 4 slots cut.  I'm having trouble understanding the wizard. 

First, I set the X and Y user coordinates to zero at the corner furthest away from me and to the right of the workpiece.  It is the same corner I chose with the Set Position in the wizard.

I want the slots to be in the Y direction.  I'm using a 3/8" cutter, and would like them slightly wider than 3/8"
I set the wizard up with the set position in the upper right corner of the graphic on the screen.  I set the following parameters.
Tool Dia, +0.375", Feed Plunge +0.10, Rough Feed +0.30, Rapid height +0.1, X Position -0.25, Step Depth +0.1, Y Position -6.5, Length 0.38,
Width 2.0, Depth +0.3.

When I post the G-Code, the first few lines look like this:
G00 X-.44 Y-8.31
G01 Z-0.1 F0.1
Y-6.69 F0.3
X-0.5375 Y-.67875
Y-8.2125
X-0.3425
Y-6.7875
X-0.5375
G00 Z0.1

My first question is why aren't my X and Y representative of what I put into the settings.  I wanted to go 6.5" in the negative Y and .25" in the negative X.  The G-Code is going to .155 in the negative X when you take 1/2 the cutter with from the second pass of .5375.  Total with of the cut is not correct either.  It's much wider.  I found also that if I increase the width number in the wizard, the cut gets narrower.

The Negative Y is going to -8.31 rather than 6.5 minus 1/2 of the cutter diameter. 

I can mess with the numbers until I get what I want, but was wondering if I'm not understanding the Wizard, or if I'm doing something wrong.

Can anyone help?
TeaMan
Re: Slot cuting wizard by Brian/Kran
« Reply #1 on: March 30, 2014, 12:26:12 AM »
Hi Ed,
   Some of the Slot Wizards will give you problems if the tool diameter is very near the finished slot width.
You will probably have better results by using one of the Rectangular Pocket wizards. You can produce a .390" wide slot with a .375" endmill with them, have done so here. (was actually a motor mount ... imagine that)

Russ
Re: Slot cuting wizard by Brian/Kran
« Reply #2 on: March 30, 2014, 08:25:05 AM »
First, please confirm exactly which wizard you are using. Is it part of the Newfangled Suite, or the new Mill Wizard, or one of the unsupported wizards that come with mach3? Since they are all very different it is hard to answer a question without knowing which one we are talking about.
Re: Slot cuting wizard by Brian/Kran
« Reply #3 on: March 30, 2014, 08:27:38 AM »
Thanks Russ.  Those darn motor mounts Huh?   :)  
Hey, care to point me to the wizard you used.  I tried the side slotting wizard using the one on the far right, and it sent my mill in the wrong direction.  I thought I tried the rectangular slot also, but don't remember.  I tried a few of them to find one that might work.  One issue I seem to have is that when I set my zero's on a corner of my workpiece, the mill seems to take off in the wrong direction.  I'm sure it's something I'm doing wrong being a TOTAL novice.  I'm trying to think of the X and Y in terms of the tool.  So if the tool was to move toward me, table away, that would be +Y, tool to the right, table left would be +X.  Z is easy.  Does that make sense?

I'm still confused on the wizard I had tried, as to why it moved to different dimension than I had input.  It was close in the X, but Y was a bit further off.  Didn't make sense.

I'll try the wizard that is called Rectangular Pocket by Brian Barker and see if I have more luck.

Hey, what is the difference between the NewFangled Wizards and the Mill Wizard?

Thanks
Ed
Re: Slot cuting wizard by Brian/Kran
« Reply #4 on: March 30, 2014, 08:31:23 AM »
Ron, it's exactly as I typed it.  "Slot Cutting", by Author Brian/Kran.  It's a wizard that is bundled with Mach3, it's not part of NewFangled wizards or Mill Wizards.

Could be an issue with the Wizard itself as Russ suggested.

Ed
Re: Slot cuting wizard by Brian/Kran
« Reply #5 on: March 30, 2014, 09:29:47 AM »
   So if the tool was to move toward me, table away, that would be +Y, tool to the right, table left would be +X.  Z is easy.  Does that make sense?

 
Your Y is backwards to conventional, the X is OK.

I'll post an example a little later.

Russ
Re: Slot cuting wizard by Brian/Kran
« Reply #6 on: March 30, 2014, 09:32:49 AM »
Ok, the wizards that come bundled, and free, are user written unsupported wizards. It is a bit confusing that Brian Barker was listed as author, but those were done while he was still just a mach user working at U Maine.

The Newfangled Suite was written by Brian and he sold them for $50 using the company name Newfangled. These wizards run as VB scripts and screen sets under mach3. They are included in the mach3 installer, and will run in demo mode without a license. You can run them and see how they work, but they wont save the gcode unless you have the license.

The Mill Wizards is a new package, aimed at  the new Mach4. They are written in c++ and are fully standalone programs. They can run on any PC without mach. They have a demo mode that wont save gcode.

Both of the paid set of wizards let you build up a full part by doing individual operations. In your motor mount part you could run the slot operation 4 times, positioning each slot at the correct location, then get out one gode file that was the entire part. The free wizards are each independent programs, they will generate the code for one operation, like a slot, but you then have to save that and do the next step as a complete new job.

So, does that help to understand the world of wizards?
Re: Slot cuting wizard by Brian/Kran
« Reply #7 on: March 30, 2014, 10:07:00 AM »
   
Hey, care to point me to the wizard you used.  

 

Thanks
Ed

I've used the one shown.

If your part 0,0 is at the upper right corner, everything is in the -X, -Y quadrant.
When cutting slots like this, I generally use the centerline x,y, position instead of the corner of the slot/pocket.

Attachments for reference.

Russ
Re: Slot cuting wizard by Brian/Kran
« Reply #8 on: March 30, 2014, 10:10:46 AM »
Oh, and I also just run the wizard for 1 slot, then use G52 to shift to the other 3 locations and run the same code multiple times.

Russ
Re: Slot cuting wizard by Brian/Kran
« Reply #9 on: March 30, 2014, 12:21:34 PM »
Thanks gentlemen.  Ron, Yes, it gives me an understanding of the wizards.  If I have my eye on Mach4, would it make more sense to get the Newfangled Mill Wizard?  Since it's stand alone, I assume it would generate G-Code that can be imported into either Mach3 now or Mach4 when it's released?

Russ, thanks for the tips.  I realized that the Y was backwards.  I was thinking properly, typing improperly.  Apparently can't do two things at once anymore.... :-*
I have one further question.  I was messing with one other wizard just to see how it might work.  It's the Keyway wizard by Brian Barker.  It looked very interested, and I found while playing with it that it showed the absolute coordinates of the cut, and realized that the wizard was not taking the size of the tool into account.  I did the simple math to remove half the tool diameter, and got what looked like it would cut the slot where I wanted and to the proper size.  I did notice something interesting when I ran it in demo mode on my laptop.  When it was moving through the Y axis, it was moving the X at the same time rather than holding it steady.  I couldn't figure out how to zoom the toolpath and be able to se what was happening with the X, but it seemed like it was getting narrower at the center rather than making a square pocket.  Since it's a keyway wizard, does it make the center narrower than the ends?  Off to try the wizard you suggested....

I fibbed, I have one more question that is just for my confidence.  It's on federates, and remember I'm a total novice.  I found several calculators, and also looked at the calculator in one of the Newfangled Mill Wizards, and it shows the federate for a 3/8" HSS, 4 flute mill cutter to be about 4.6 ipm.  For some reason I envision my cutter to find a home other than in the collet of my machine running at that speed.  Although my reading tells me that too slow heats the cutter up and destroys it.  I have a small 3 in 1 machine, just trying to build some confidence to run it this way.  Also the plunge rate is about 2.32 ipm.  Again seems fast for my little machine.  I think the machine can handle it, but just don't have the confidence.  Any advice?

Thanks
Ed