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Converting Wadkin UX Router to DspMC, a couple of unknowns
« on: January 18, 2013, 05:09:30 PM »
Hi there,

i am shortly hoping to convert the Wadkin UX series router ( pictured below) to run using the DspMC  and mach3 combo.

i am completely self taught (well google taught) and jumped in at the deep end with this Wadkin as my first CNC about 2 years ago and have learnt a lot and now have a pretty good idea or my way around the machine and how most of it works, but am finding the Bosch cc120 control a bit limiting,  small memory no way ( for me) to reprogram and use probe inputs etc.

for converting to a DspMCi have a couple of unknowns that i need some help to know where to look / how to work out.

1:

the drives ( bosch SM 10/20)  seem to require a deferential analogue input, and as far as i can tell all the analogue outputs of the DSPMC are single ended, will i need to make a balancing circuit, or a centre tapped transformer ( my background is Live audio, balanced / Unbalanced signal conversion happens all over the place)  i have attached pictures of the current wireing schematic SW- and SW+ are the analogue inputs for the amp, and i translated Soilwertdifferenzeingang to mean differential input.  - any idea's?

2.  how do i find out how many counts per revolution my encoders are,  the machine is fitted with Heidenhain ROD 426.029b -1000 encoders,  i think the 1000 may indicate 1000 counts?

3.  how do i work out the amount each axis moves per revolution,  or is it best to measure it ? digital callipers a good enough starting point, or should i get a dial

4.  how best to implement the Z-axis break?  i need to spend a bit more time looking in to how its currently implemented,  but i guess this should be done outside of DSPMC, controlled directly by the drive ready signal so if the drive faults / looses power  / E stop the break is activated. 


thanks a lot for any advice anyone can give me.


Matt


Re: Converting Wadkin UX Router to DspMC, a couple of unknowns
« Reply #1 on: January 18, 2013, 08:27:14 PM »
#1. You can connect directly to the DSPMC breakout board. In your case connect take axis 0 as an example. Connect SW+ to pin 15 analog out 0 and SW- to pin 7 or 17. The DSPMC outputs +/- 10v on its analog outputs.
#2 You are most likely correct that the encoders are 1000 count.
#3 You can try to calculate this but I find it better to get close and then measure it on the machine to make sure it is correct. A set of digital calipers will get you in the ball park but a good dial indicator and some good 1,2,3 blocks will dial it in exactly.
#4. I am doing this on a Kollmorgen ac servo drive and I use the drive ready signal to release the brake. On my Z axixs with out the brake on and without the PID loop active the axis will just coast down. When the brake comes off, you will need to make sure that the PID loop is active.

HTH
Mike
We never have the time or money to do it right the first time, but we somehow manage to do it twice and then spend the money to get it right.
Re: Converting Wadkin UX Router to DspMC, a couple of unknowns
« Reply #2 on: January 19, 2013, 11:17:04 AM »
Hi Mike,

Thanks a lot for the speedy response, as soon as the DSPMC turns up i should be up and running in no time.

to ensure that your PID loop is active, do you have mach3 also output a ready line in to a second contractor ?  i haven't tested this yet but my Z-axis has a pneumatic counterbalance, which if its set up correctly i would guess the axis shouldn't coast down unless it was moving quickly before an e-stop.

thanks

Matt
Re: Converting Wadkin UX Router to DspMC, a couple of unknowns
« Reply #3 on: January 19, 2013, 01:19:27 PM »
Hi Matt,
No problem on the response. I help out where I can and when I can. Hood usually beats to me the answers on things that we both know. LOL

As to your problem, Mach3 has an axis enable signal that I use to enable the drives when Mach3 is brought out of e-stop. This enable signal allows the drive to come up and be ready. Coming out of e-stop also arms PID loop. When the drive is ready (internally) it unlocks the brake via an output on the drive that applies power to release the brake. When you hit e-stop, or hit a limit switch, the drive enable signal from Mach3 gets cut, the drive ready signal drops out from inside the drive and the brake is reapplied.
I hope that is clear as to what is going on.

Mike
We never have the time or money to do it right the first time, but we somehow manage to do it twice and then spend the money to get it right.
Re: Converting Wadkin UX Router to DspMC, a couple of unknowns
« Reply #4 on: March 14, 2013, 07:10:54 AM »
Hi Mike, & everyone

its been a while,  but i now have the DSPMC, Breakout boards & mach3 set up in front of me running on a bench supply, trying to get as much done before taking it all down to the machine, as its very cold down there at the moment and i have no internet access there for problem solving.

i am currently trying to implement the machines drives Soft Start, where there are 2 contactors,  one through some kind of ballast / resistor bank and the other direct to the drive's power supply.  

the current control seems to switch these with a small ( aprox 2 second ) delay, i guess to avoid massive inrush currents.   there are also secondary mechanically linked contractors, used to let the control know each contactor is definitely engaged, and a air pressure switch, triggered by a pressure regulator. ( to stop drives being turned on with no air pressure, because of the pneumatic counterbalance)

after doing some digging,  i'm guessing the best way for me to implement the above with DSPMC is via a DSPMacro running directly on the DSPMC ?   i have tried to test this, but am unable to upload a macro to the DSPMC yet,  i get a programming checksum error.

if i can some how implement the above with brains i guess that would be easier and quicker to problem solve ?    looks like this is all going to be a tad more complicated than i thought,  but thats always the way with CNC isnt it?   ???  

below is a list of all the other I/O the current control has implemented :

Inputs:

Vac Clamped Right
Vac Clamped Left
Mains Air Presure
Vac 1 Overload
Vac 2 Overload
Drives Breaking Resister aux contacts
RouterHead Overloa
ToolChanger Overload
BTB1 ASM unit
BTB2 ASM unit
BTB1 VM unit
BTB2 VM unit
Drives Soft Start Aux contact
Drives Line Aux contact
Master Relay
All axis OverTravel Positive
All Axis Overtravel Negative
Remote Vac Clamp Left off Push button
Remote Vac Clamp Right off Push button
E-Stop
X Axis Reference Switch
Y Axis Reference Switch
Z Axis Reference Switch
Remote Cycle Start
Remote Cycle Stop
BTB Ready Signal SMX
BTB Ready Signal SMY
BTB Ready Signal SMZ
Remote Vac Clamp Left On Push Button
Remote Vac Clamp Right On Push Button
Tool Changer Reference Proximity
ToolChanger Position Proximity
ToolChanger in Top Position
ToolChanger In Bot Position
ToolChanger Towards Head
ToolChange Inch Push Button
 ToolChanger Away From Head
Tool Changer Inch Foward Push Button
Carousel Lock On Proximity
ToolChanger Inch Reverse
Router Head Over Temp
Head Tool Release Button
Extraction Flow Moniter
ToolEjected
Tool In HEAd
Router Head Stationary
Head 1 Draw Bolt Proximity
T/C Gard Door Switch
Router Hood Position 1
Router Hood AT top
Router Head in Top Postion
RouterHead at Bottom Position
RouterHood in position 2
Router Hood in position 3

Outputs:

Vacume Pump 1 Contactor
Vacume Pump 2 Contactor
Drives SoftStart Contactor
Drives Line Contactor Coil
Inverter 1 Enable
ToolChange Foward
T/C Stroke Up down
Router Hood Raise
Router Hood Lower
TC Stroke In / Out
Vacuum Clamp Right
Lower Head Solenoid
Drill Set 1 Solenoid
Drill 1 Lower
Drives Enable Relay
Lube On
Z Axis Break Relay
Vacuum Clamp Left
Head 1 Tool Release
Tool Changer Reverse
TC Carousel Lock

Im glad i decided to get all this up and running on a bench, rather than jumping in and taking the existing control off from the machine. looks like i may run out of time to get it all working this year  ( i get very busy with My real job soon)

Cheers

Matt
Re: Converting Wadkin UX Router to DspMC, a couple of unknowns
« Reply #5 on: March 15, 2013, 06:10:18 AM »
Hi Matt,
you should be able to implement the drive contactor timing using brains and a timer function.
Nice to see you are making great progress.

Mike
We never have the time or money to do it right the first time, but we somehow manage to do it twice and then spend the money to get it right.
Re: Converting Wadkin UX Router to DspMC, a couple of unknowns
« Reply #6 on: March 18, 2014, 10:32:17 AM »
hello  Freinds;
really i started to retrofit my CNC machine and i found this post as a great reference.

also me have CC100 bosch control that i need to replace with MACH 3

i have bosch sm 10/20 servo drive and i know that i need DSPMC motion controller for using analog DIf. +/-10vdc to control

SW+ and SW- are the analog inputs for the control.

But, its not clear to me the Encoder and the tachometer connections.
in the elect. layout of the driver looks like the encoder and the tachometer need -+15vds power supply but the DSPMC tacho and Encoder are 5vdc?? ??--any idea about?

also, in the elec. layout its seem that the Encoder cable comes directly to the Servodrive (no connection to the controller) is it logic???

if anybody do this job before please let me know!!

regards




Re: Converting Wadkin UX Router to DspMC, a couple of unknowns
« Reply #7 on: March 26, 2014, 02:23:49 AM »
Hi Matt and Hoodand everybody;

i have a question to Matt about the bosch ServoDrive hes have.

i understood that its Bosch SM 10/20, So what about the encoders connection??

do you have a connection between the encoder and the driver???

what is your encoder voltage?? 5vdc or 15vdc.
whitch voltage supplies the sm10/20 that you have to the encoder.
what about the tachometer connection? did you connect it the DSPMC??

i have the same drivers system and i want to retorfit it the machine using MACH 3

my proplem that i have no Electrical Docs for the machine (very old-1994). and also i have no Docs for the drivers(also in BULLERI -italy they have not).

anybody can help me??

regards'
Ghantos






Re: Converting Wadkin UX Router to DspMC, a couple of unknowns
« Reply #8 on: February 22, 2015, 10:56:41 AM »
Hello everybody,
First of all, please be indulgent with my english ... i am french!
Let me introduce myself: I am between 50 and 60 years old ... this is my forth work life and always built cnc machines in my sapre time , Wrote my own cnc sw in the 90's upto internet exists ans i found people dedicated to that with a much better software named MACH3 ...My background is mostly electronics and acoustic, my last job : building very large digital audio mixing console for concert.
I have built and run something like ten CNC machines, from very small to quite large and fixed another dozen ... but still learning...

Two days ago I bought a 1992 Wadkin UXCLC3
This the subject that makes me write something here because I have the same objectiv than Bungle: move that cnc from its NUM720 to Mach3 and DSPMC or the same from the competition. I now sure that everybody will give me the arguments to go with DSPMC ;)

At first I thought i will be quite easy ... but the machine is quite complex and the powerfull servo and spindle drive me to be think "Safety first" which makes things more complex.

My first approach was to keep the wiring and NUM IO modules and that think "It Should BE possible" to connect the optical fiber to MACH3 with some magical driver or plugin... but NUM is not talking a lot about its proprietatry protocol (RS485 if we remove fiber)... any idea on this point?

I can read that Bungle did the same : congratulations Bungle, you are two years in advance .... good.

Last (for my first post here) but not least : I have no electrical nor pneumatic schematics of my machine  >:( ..... is it the same for you Bungle?

Thanks to spend time reading my approximative english.
Best regards
Gerard

 
Re: Converting Wadkin UX Router to DspMC, a couple of unknowns
« Reply #9 on: February 24, 2015, 03:47:29 AM »
Hello Ghantos,

unfortunately i haven't progressed any further with my machine  since my posts on here,   -
 i have my DSPMC and IO boards wired up to Dsubs ready to replace the Cc120 control,  however when bench testing and attempting to build a simple "brain" for the soft start  contactors for my Drives i felt that brains were not responsive enough,  maybe 500 - 1000 ms delay between an input change and the brain responding.

 then looked in to implementing this in a macro running on the dspmc its self, quickly realised that recreating the current PLC in a macro was beyond me, and then went on Tour so have been too busy since then to progress.

i do have full electrical schematics for my machine, which is a big help,  i also have manuals for my drives.  they are in german but still useful.

which audio console did you work on ?   i am a live sound engineer for my day job.

thanks