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Router heads
« on: December 15, 2009, 07:07:06 PM »
I just burned a DeWalt 2-1/4 HP router up somehow, after three months of use. It had been losing RPMs during cycles; sounded like it was trying to work through a brownout at times. Tried to spin the tip and it has all but siezed. I'm cutting 3/16" polycarbonate on top of MDF spoil with a 3/16" Onsrud 65-018 upspiral bit. It has been working well, but the last week I would notice it bog down for a split second every now and then. Well now it finally crapped. So I'm wondering if I'm pushing a consumer grade tool too hard, is my feed rate too fast, etc. I have the router set at max speed 24k rpm, and the feed rate through LazyCam into Mach at 70. Router doesn't seem like it's going too fast, as I get no burning smells or blackened bits, and the router speed lowers slightly but not by much(ear test).
So I need a new router, obviously, and these things aren't cheap. What's a good one to use? Anyone have any insight as to why I burned this one up so quickly?
Re: Router heads
« Reply #1 on: December 15, 2009, 07:19:29 PM »
Maybe you could consider buying a water cooled spindle, sure it is more money but I think it will last longer.
 

http://cgi.ebay.com/WATER-COOLE-MOTOR-SPINDLE-1-5KW-AND-MATCHING-INVERTER_W0QQitemZ230400340462QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item35a4ee31ee.

I have one for about one year and run great, no problem at all.

And they are very quiet, you can use bit of any size.

Just my idea.

Jeff

Offline Sam

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Re: Router heads
« Reply #2 on: December 15, 2009, 08:14:21 PM »
Quote
So I'm wondering if I'm pushing a consumer grade tool too hard
I will catch allot of flak for this I'm sure, but I can sum it up in one word.....DeWalt
In my own humble opinion, there has never been a more over-rated/over priced tools than DeWalt. I have burned up a couple Dewalt motors in my time, with little effort.
Porter Cable, Bosch, and Milwaukee seem to me to be pretty good quality tools, and most of the time cheaper than DeWalt. I simply refuse to buy anything DeWalt.

If I were going to spend $300+ on a new variable speed router, that water cooled option might be pretty tempting. The noise reduction alone would be worth allot. Maybe next year if I'm good Santa will bring me one.
"CONFIDENCE: it's the feeling you experience before you fully understand the situation."

Offline ger21

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Re: Router heads
« Reply #3 on: December 15, 2009, 08:48:57 PM »
I'd spend $30 more and and get a bigger one.
http://cgi.ebay.com/WATER-COOLE-MOTOR-SPINDLE-2-2KW-AND-MATCHING-INVERTER_W0QQitemZ370297211895QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item56376f0bf7

AS for the Dewalt, have you checked the brushes? Or is it the bearings? Replacing the bearings is fairly cheap.

Are you cutting at 70 ipm? If so, that's way too slow for 24,000 rpm. According to Onsrud, you should be cutting at over 150 ipm at 24K rpm.
https://www.onsrud.com/xdoc/FeedSpeeds
Gerry

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Offline simpson36

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Re: Router heads
« Reply #4 on: December 16, 2009, 10:46:19 AM »
I have only cut a little bit of polycarb, so I don't know if it has similar characteristics to acrylic relative to killing bearings.

My guess is that the dust got into the bearings. You mat find that replacing the bearings with quality sealed bearings will solve the problem and increase the accuracy of the spindle as well.

If you are able, it would be a good idea to fit a 'slinger' on the nose of the spindle between the collet and the bearing as well.

I get most of my miniature bearings from BocaBearing. They have a non-contact seal that they call 'ultraseal' which I have used in RC helicopters with good success. There is no machine on the planet that destroys bearings faster than an RC helicopter,  so I would imagine they are a candidate for a high speed spindle motor. They have them in ceramic, but I don't know if they are available in ABEC3.

I replaced both the spindle and motor bearingd in my X2 with SKF 'precision plus' series. These are very nice 'middle of the road' bearings and are quiet, accurate and reasonably priced. I would categorize them as entry level commercial or high end hobby. Pay attention to the recommended max RPM  . . the limitation is normally imposed by the seal material.

NOTE: I am providing only information and not an endorsement or recommendation.
« Last Edit: December 16, 2009, 10:52:44 AM by simpson36 »
Re: Router heads
« Reply #5 on: December 16, 2009, 01:32:15 PM »
I'd spend $30 more and and get a bigger one.
http://cgi.ebay.com/WATER-COOLE-MOTOR-SPINDLE-2-2KW-AND-MATCHING-INVERTER_W0QQitemZ370297211895QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item56376f0bf7

AS for the Dewalt, have you checked the brushes? Or is it the bearings? Replacing the bearings is fairly cheap.

Are you cutting at 70 ipm? If so, that's way too slow for 24,000 rpm. According to Onsrud, you should be cutting at over 150 ipm at 24K rpm.
https://www.onsrud.com/xdoc/FeedSpeeds

Yeah well I'm using leadscrews for all axes and I'm using 3/4" dia screws for the long axis when they really should have been 1" or larger. So I'm going as fast as I can go before the screws begin to whip. Also my motors are not the most sophisticated steppers out there, so yeah I'm going as fast as I can go, but it's good to know I'm not going too fast.

Offline ger21

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Re: Router heads
« Reply #6 on: December 16, 2009, 01:33:55 PM »
Then you should cut your RPM's to about 15000.
Gerry

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Re: Router heads
« Reply #7 on: December 16, 2009, 06:10:35 PM »
Today I fitted an old cheap 2hp Craftsman single speed(20Krpm) and it cut very cleanly, but seemed to bog a little. As long as it's cutting this well I'll leave it and see how long it takes to burn out. I'm going to try and get the DeWalt apart and see what's going on.

By the way I looked at those water-cooled spindles on eBay- those are Chinese. Some Chinese router stuff is kinda crappy. I'd probably be willing to try something like that but it looks like it could be wired directly into the breakout board and controlled through Mach, yes? If so that would be really cool. And what is the ER20 collet size referring to? I would definitely need a collet that held standard sized bits.
« Last Edit: December 16, 2009, 06:19:52 PM by bergdoerfer »

Offline ger21

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Re: Router heads
« Reply #8 on: December 16, 2009, 06:37:48 PM »
There are a lot of people buying the Chinese routers and I haven't heard any bad reviews.

ER20 collets come in many different sizes, from 1/32" up to 1/2". To control the spindle with Mach3 you'll need a 0-10V analog output, or a speed control board that has one.
Gerry

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