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Author Topic: IF you had a NEW controller whta would it do/not do ?  (Read 8767 times)

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Re: IF you had a NEW controller whta would it do/not do ?
« Reply #10 on: July 18, 2015, 11:22:09 AM »


But what happens when these people start learning and want to do more? You're catering exclusively to entry level users.
 
 

Then I would move up to a more full featured product. Might eventually require commercial equipment.
I think that in addition to entry level users, it would cater to hobby folks that do not require the additional features, the (probably) large percentage of folks that jump in, get their feet went then leave and those that desire to make simple projects ... and nothing more.

One might start a hauling company with a used pick-up truck and see how it goes. Might eventually by a semi or 2 but surely would not start out with a fleet of locomotives and 747's.  :)

Offline ger21

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Re: IF you had a NEW controller whta would it do/not do ?
« Reply #11 on: July 18, 2015, 11:35:35 AM »
The simple answer? A bug free Mach3 with the Tempest planner.

Seriously. What features are lacking from Mach3? (If everything worked correctly)

The vast majority of users that are moving on from Mach3 are doing so because of bugs that they can't workaround.

OK, let's see.

I think the ability to customize screens is very important. Unfortunately, the people writing control software have show that they are not very good at GUI design.
And no matter how well thought out the GUI is, there;s a good chance that someone else can improve on it.

G41/G42 -  To me, this is mandatory. Anyone that's ever run a "big iron" router knows that using G41/G42 is very common. In our shop, I have at least $500-$1000 in 1/2" router bits. After sharpening, none of them are 1/2" anymore. We often run hundreds of unique programs every day, and being able to program for a 1/2" bit for all of them saves an incredible amount of time.
What if I program for a .489" bit one day, and it get's dull before I can run my part? The new bit is .474". without G41/G42, I have to go back and redo all my programs. With G41/G42, just change the diameter in the tool table and start cutting.

Having worked this way fro 20 years, why would I want to go backwards

G43 - Imo, not needed unless you have an ATC, and even then you can work around it. Thousands of people are letting Mach3 automatically zero tools during toolchanges with my screenset and other macros with similar functionality. G43 might be a little faster with a lot of tool changes, but requires a method to have fixed length tooling, which most routers do not have.

Macro or scripting support - I could live without this if the features I'd use scripting for were native functions.
What I need is support for two independent Z axis, via a SwapAxis() type function
Auto Zero during tool changes.
Customizable homing.
User definable park positions.

If all these were native functions, then I wouldn't need scripting.

I don't use offsets very often but they are needed in some situations.

Actually, a bug free Mach3 with Tempest would be all that I'd really need.

Gerry

2010 Screenset
http://www.thecncwoodworker.com/2010.html

JointCAM Dovetail and Box Joint software
http://www.g-forcecnc.com/jointcam.html

Offline BR549

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Re: IF you had a NEW controller whta would it do/not do ?
« Reply #12 on: July 18, 2015, 02:17:42 PM »
On the screensets I feel different all l that is needed is a basic screenset that has all the basic functions of CNC. IF you need more than that you are using the WRONG software.  IF it did all the basic functions of CNC what MORE would you REALLY need.  

Most users to day just want to WATCH the machine make a part not spend days trying to figure out HOW to do it.

Keep HOBBY in the back of your mind IF I were having to make a living with it the SPECS would change dramatically . Been there done that and have the hat, teeshirt and coffecup.

Even M3 has a great deal of overkill for TODAYS average user.

(;-) TP
« Last Edit: July 18, 2015, 02:21:54 PM by BR549 »

Offline BR549

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Re: IF you had a NEW controller whta would it do/not do ?
« Reply #13 on: July 18, 2015, 02:47:56 PM »
Probing is a neccesity You need it for tool height setting and replicating things. It needs

G31 straight probe with inverse motion. It runs to trip then backs off. That alone can save a ton of programing.

G31 /G2  probes in G2 arc as defined  These are the cats meow for 3d probing routines of the creepy crawler methods both 3d and 2d contouring
G31/G3  probes in G3 as defined  

Saved points ONLY on trip not end of motion. End of motion would be an error could write error 999.999 code in saved points        

Protected mode motion other than G31



Offline ger21

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Re: IF you had a NEW controller whta would it do/not do ?
« Reply #14 on: July 18, 2015, 03:59:01 PM »
You're equating hobbyist with beginner or basic user. Unless that's exactly who you're targeting??
I would think that many hobbyists tend do be very serious or hardcore users.
Pick any hobby, and you can find multi million dollar industries that cater to the whims of these "hobbyists".

They don't want the basic entry level setup. Because they chose it as their hobby, they really like doing it, and will want the latest and greatest, with as many features as possible.
Gerry

2010 Screenset
http://www.thecncwoodworker.com/2010.html

JointCAM Dovetail and Box Joint software
http://www.g-forcecnc.com/jointcam.html

Offline BR549

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Re: IF you had a NEW controller whta would it do/not do ?
« Reply #15 on: July 18, 2015, 04:53:27 PM »
HIYA Gerry , I have found that WANTING features and actually USING features tend to be 2 very different things.  It is like buying a new car Why buy a new Porche when a standard sedan will do the same job at a fraction of the cost and complexity of owning.

That would be apples vs oranges.  

I have been setting down and actually taking things and creating and running code to test the theory. I don't NEED a great deal of the features in Mach3 just to create accurate parts. The is the main theme of the discussion WHAT do you actually need to make parts.

G00 yes
g01 yes
g02 yes
g03 yes
go4 yes

G10 NO
G12/13 NO

G40 -49 NO

G50 yes
G54-59 NO
G68 yes

G80 /81/83/71/84 yes
the rest of the canned cycles NO

M98/99 subs NO

G65/66 macros NO

#vars NO

Wizards NO (use your conversational cam )

Screens sets other than a basic  function screen NO
 MOST Other controllers are doing FINE with a preset functions SCreensets Most do NOT have a screenbuilder or even need one. All the basic functions are all ready on screen.

Sit down with a stock 1024 screenset and then strip out everything you do NOT need. You will have a LOT of room left over (;-) I know I did. AND could still cut parts out just fine. ADN when I mean strip out I mean strip out. NO background stuff JUST the basic DROs buttons and inputs.

IS it a different mind set YEP. But so is the mind set of the newest generation of DIY CNCers.  Dorthy we ain't in Kansas no more .  

(;-) TP

« Last Edit: July 18, 2015, 04:57:55 PM by BR549 »

Offline BR549

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Re: IF you had a NEW controller whta would it do/not do ?
« Reply #16 on: July 18, 2015, 05:08:06 PM »
OOPS don't really need teh canned cycles at ALL CAM  will do it all quite nicely.

That is my WANT sneaking back in there.

(;-) TP

Offline BR549

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Re: IF you had a NEW controller whta would it do/not do ?
« Reply #17 on: July 18, 2015, 05:09:46 PM »
Come on Guys I KNOW there are more than the 5 of us here. WHAT do YOU say ??

SPEAK UP

(;-) TP

Offline Chaoticone

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Re: IF you had a NEW controller whta would it do/not do ?
« Reply #18 on: July 18, 2015, 05:23:05 PM »
Quote
I was part of a group discussion the other day about WHAT is needed IF one was to build a new DIY controller for "TODAY'S" hobby users.

I know I am a bit late here but I think the first thing to do is define Hobby users Vs. CNC hobbyist. IMO they are worlds apart.

Who would this controller be aimed at pleasing? Those using a CNC in their Hobby or those who's hobby is CNC?
;D If you could see the things I have in my head, you would be laughing too. ;D

My guard dog is not what you need to worry about!
Re: IF you had a NEW controller whta would it do/not do ?
« Reply #19 on: July 18, 2015, 05:28:09 PM »
You're equating hobbyist with beginner or basic user. Unless that's exactly who you're targeting??
This illustrates the 'spectrum" I mentioned earlier and I think you should target the lower end for this type of endeavor.
Quote
I would think that many hobbyists tend do be very serious or hardcore users.
I'd say many do as well, but probably most don't.
Quote
Pick any hobby, and you can find multi million dollar industries that cater to the whims of these "hobbyists".

They don't want the basic entry level setup. Because they chose it as their hobby, they really like doing it, and will want the latest and greatest, with as many features as possible.
Some certainly do, many also use full featured hobby software to retrofit "Big Iron, Thousand files a day" commercial operations.
It's all in how you choose to define Hobby .... and where to divide the spectrum.
One size WON'T fit all.
There are products for the upper end, this would be great for the lower end.
IMO, mid to lower end, :)
Russ

« Last Edit: July 18, 2015, 06:43:53 PM by Overloaded »