thanks ger21 I've tried to look for a bit source around here in Canada where we use the metric system ( but buy all lumber and bits in imperial ). As far as bending a bit i've never seen that happen before and I have use 3 to 35mm bits in our cnc as work for yrs running around 12,000rpm. I'm just drilling 7/16 into particale board, but ty again for the link for the bit sorce. Anyone out there care to machine me a simple split sleeve on a lathe??