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Messages - smurph

Galil / Re: DMC-2133+servo+Mach3
« on: March 25, 2013, 12:03:02 AM »
Yeah, you will have to get a different ICM for that 21x3 board.  Unless you have, and want to use, the motors that went with that Force Dynamics ICM.  Go to Galil's website and lookup the ICM that you need. 

ICM-20100    Interconnect with D-type
ICM-20105    Interconnect with optoisolated I/O

These are the usual suspects.


Galil / Re: Galil support
« on: March 16, 2013, 03:28:14 AM »
Unfortunately, Galil has been plagued with support calls from people that buy the surplus controllers that have been dumped on the auctions sites.  And we are partly to blame.  :(  But most of the time they will support these controllers if they were sold by Galil in the first place.

They also sell controllers to companies at a reduced cost with the agreement that these companies provide the support.  I think this is what happened to you.

I have a few Galil 1341 VME bus controllers that if you call Galil with a question about, they ask "What is a 1341?".  They do special boards for companies that were never meant to be in the "wild".  They are like one off designs and they cannot possibly be supported.  Their support techs will not even know of their existence.

If your controller does indeed have a bad input, then Galil will service it for a very modest fee.  Just follow their return instructions on their site.  I've had numerous controllers repaired and I have never been disappointed or sticker shocked.  

Also, you can post to their web forum and get a lot of help there from the Galil staff as well as other users.

I still think Galil is a very friendly company.  Much better than others that I shall refrain from naming.


Galil / Re: camsoft conversion
« on: February 20, 2013, 07:03:08 PM »
I have never configured a opto22 with the galil.  :( They have instructions on how it is done on the Galil web site.  And it depends on what is driving the opto22 board.  If it is a Contec card, I wrote a plugin for capsteve that can be downloaded.  If the galil is already wired directly to it (using extended io, etc...), then all you have to do is some galil plugin config.


Galil / Re: Remote jog pendant again
« on: February 04, 2013, 02:21:39 PM »
Nice!  That sharpening proggy will be sweeeeeeeeet!

Galil / Re: Remote jog pendant again
« on: January 24, 2013, 03:18:20 PM »
I think it will work.  After all, it is just going to duplicate what you can do on the tab screen.  I had no idea these type of pendants existed before this thread.  Some are quite cool!  I would wonder how durable these things are.  But at that price, you can have 3 in stock! 

Galil / Re: Remote jog pendant again
« on: January 24, 2013, 12:25:06 AM »
I think that pendant only provides MPG control.  MPG is Manual Pulse Generator.  The hand wheel is just a 100 detent encoder.  Each detent is usually one pulse (or 4 in quadrature).  In combination with the increment selection, you can move the axis one detent on the hand wheel encoder to get a ratio of movement on the axis.  For example, setting your increment to .001" would mean that your axis would move .001" for every detent.  One full rotation (100 detents) would yield .100"  Setting the jog increment to .010" would move the axis .010" for every detent on the hand wheel encoder.  Or a full 1.000" per full revolution of the hand wheel.  It needs to be tightly coupled with the motion controller otherwise you will get erratic axis movement.  MPG is very different that what is provided on the tab screen.  The tab screen functionality is really just button jogging.

I took a look at the page again and I didn't see jog buttons.  It has a toggle for the jog mode (Right arrow) and a toggle for the jog increment (Left arrow).  But MPGs use those as well so it is not unusual for them to be there.  But I don't see jog buttons proper.  Maybe I'm misunderstanding the broken English on the page (which is an alarm bell for me).  But I really think that is just a fancy MPG.

Here is a video of the wireless version of that pendant: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hRd1zSRFp50  I saw no push button jogging.  The whole pendant seems to use the hand wheel.  Even for feed rate and spindle speed.  A neat little device!  However, it is not really going to be friendly with an external motion controller such as the Galil.  :(


Now that looks like a jog pendant to me.  No hand wheel.  Sans the coordinate display though.  But that one looks like it would be plug and play.  Press a button and jog away.  If you didn't want to go to the trouble of wiring up an MPG, then that is what I would suggest using.  But do your research.  Look around and find something you will be happy with.  There are lots to choose from.  Google "Mach 3 Jog Pendant"


Galil / Re: Remote jog pendant again
« on: January 23, 2013, 05:25:31 PM »
Well...  Allen is only looking for jog control.  Not MPG control.  So his case is a little different.  For MPG, you about HAVE to wire it directly in to the Galil or the MPG movements will be so jerky that you will not even use it.  

But there is the possibility that you can get half way there with the USB pendant.  (as described previously)

Unless you talk to the seller of the pendant and get his protocol, you will not be able to do much with that data.  You would most likely have to write your own plugin even if you had the protocol information.  You are talking months of work to use a ~$115.00 pendant.  Or you could possibly work with the seller and see if he is willing to help out.  Any way you slice it though, you are not going to dump that pendant data directly into a brain and get anything useful.  The brains are limited by what inputs can drive it.  You will need some other layer to parse the data into a form (LEDs, DROs, etc..) that the brains can use.


Galil / Re: Remote jog pendant again
« on: January 23, 2013, 02:27:10 PM »
Ok Allen, I finally got off my ass and fired up the machine.  :)  Here is the brain info:

In the screen shot of the brain (my X axis jog brain), you will see the OEM LEDs in the left hand column.  1125 is the positive jog direction switch and 1126 is the negative jog direction switch.  LED 1122 is lit when the axis selector switch is selecting axis X.

I used a modbus device to update the status of those LEDs.  Basically, there is another brain I used to do that.  But you could use the Galil inputs just as easily.  You would map the Galil inputs to some spare OEMTRIGGERs in ports and pins and use those instead of LEDs.  Or, if you have extended IO on your controller, you could map those inputs to LEDs.  What ever you choose will be in the left column as the brain lobe inputs. 

So to go over the logic a bit...  if the axis selector switch is in the X position, my LED 1122 is set to ON.  If I then press the jog + button on my panel, then LED 1125 is also set to on.  I then take the logical and of these two brain inputs to drive a pulse timer that "pushes" the Mach JogX-Right button.  So IF 1125 is on AND 1122 is on, push jog right.

Same thing for the left or negative jog.  Just a different LED that gets lit up when the jog - button is pressed on the panel.

The last action the brain does is test see if the direction buttons have been let off.  And it presses the Jog off X button if so.

It is important to note that to jog an axis in Mach with the brains, you have to provide the button down event to start the jog and then provide the button up event to stop the jog.  If the third action were not there, the axis would start jogging when you pressed a direction button and it would continue to jog until it hit a limit or the end of the table travel!

Also, the brains only perform an action once per state change.  So when you let off a direction button, it only runs the third action one time.  You can see this in action if you "view" the brain file in the brain control dialog.  (Operator->Brain Control).

I have three brain files.  One for each axis.  They are different only by which LEDs are processed and by which mach "buttons" are pressed.  X for X actions, Y for Y actions, etc...  The separate brain files are purely a matter of being able to see what you are doing in the brain editor.  A large brain file gets hard to read.  The brain editor leaves a lot to be desired, unfortunately.  But it does work.

I also have a brain that reads my analog Jog Feed Rate pot on the panel.  So I can adjust the jog rate without having to use the tab screen.  (See the attached pic of my panel.)

It was all a bit of a pain to setup and get working.  But...  it was well worth it.  I don't have to use the keyboard for any jog ops.  I have a button on the screen that selects the jog mode (cont, incr, or MPG) and a button that toggles the jog increment.  If I had more real estate on my panel, I could have put buttons on it for those as well.  But my screen is a touch screen, so it is almost like having a button anyway.  It is a large panel, but I put a large monitor in it.  Which is nice because I can't see the way I used to!  :)  But it did make the area for "real" buttons a bit tight.  All of the buttons got recycled from the original Yasnac controller.  I quite like the feel of the jog buttons and I wanted to keep them.  The Cycle Start and Feed Hold buttons were retained, as well as the analog spindle RPM and load gauges.  And I love having the original tool changer controls on the panel as well.  I think it turned out to be a nice combination of the "new" and the "old". 


Galil / Re: Remote jog pendant again
« on: January 23, 2013, 12:53:56 PM »

The Galil inputs and Mach brains only have an indirect relationship with the position displayed by the Mach DROs.  The Galil inputs and the brains are the mechanism by which you will drive the axes.  The position information is a function of the Galil moving the axes and updating Mach with the new locations.

If you jogged an axis though the Galil terminal while Mach was up and idling (I can do that with my Ethernet controllers but I have not tried it with a bus controller), Mach's DROs would update.  The Galil plugin always updates Mach with the position information.  The Mach DROs display actual Galil positions, not Mach calculated positions.  It is not at all like a parallel port stepper system where Mach has to keep up with the position information.  

You basically have two ways of accomplishing what you want to do:
1.  Use Galil inputs to drive Galil code to jog your axes.
2.  Use any input device to drive brains that push virtual Mach buttons and let Mach drive the axes just like if you were pressing the jog buttons on the tab screen.

Option 1 is probably more complex as you will have to figure a way to honor Mach's jog rules.  And using Galil code will require using Galil inputs.
Option 2 works like a charm and you don't have to use Galil inputs if you don't want to.  

Either way, the position info will be updated automatically.


1. Yes, the MPG encoder wires must be hooked to the Galil.  
2. Mach 3 doesn't monitor the encoder input with the Galil plugin.  The Galil plugin gears (slaves) the desired axis to the MPG encoder.  There is nothing Mach has to do other than sit back and enjoy the ride.
3. If you wire the axis selection and increment switch outputs of the MPG to inputs on the Galil (or some other input device), then you can make a brain file to select the axis, jog mode, and increment without having to use the tab screen.

The end goal is to be able to select the Y axis on the pendant axis selection switch, select the increment on the pendant increment switch, hold the button down to select MPG jog mode, and move the Y axis with the hand wheel.  

Mach supports 3 MPGs.  I have one on my panel (MPG1) and a remote pendant (MPG2).  I can move X with the panel encoder and Y with the pendant encoder if I so chose.  Or any other combination.  But it is important to note that the actual MPG encoder movement is not processes by Mach.  The Galil does it all.  However, Mach is used for the setup information such counts per unit of the MPG, getting the selected axis and increment, etc... That is why a brain is needed.  And the Galil plugin code honors Mach's jog rules (can't move an axis with the MPG when Mach is moving that axis).

As attractive as that USB pendant seems, I would be very wary of using it.  There is no telling if the MPG could be hacked to wire directly to the Galil encoder inputs.  But...  If you could do that, then you basically would not have to use a brain at all.  The USB connection would drive the axis selection, increment, and jog mode.  And the encoder would drive the axis.  And you would gain the rest of the functionality that the pendant offers.

The other unknown is what kind of information does the pendant stream through the USB connection?  If the encoder was disconnected from it and wired straight to the Galil, then is the pendant going to provide Mach with bogus information?  I'm not sure if it would even matter.  But that is the problem.  We just don't know.  Or will the pendant simply fault out and just refuse to work if the encoder is not wired to it?  Lots of questions here...

I guess it all depends on if you are willing to take the gamble.  If it works, it will rock.  If not, you have a paper weight.


Galil / Re: Remote jog pendant again
« on: January 22, 2013, 07:20:22 PM »
That looks to be a MPG.  I think AMorris was looking for just a jog pendant.  However, I don't believe that you will get that one working with the Gall or any other external motion controller.  The problem comes from how Mach communicates to the external controller.  It is a timed loop.  So that loop time will introduce latency for every move you make on the hand wheel.  That is why we put MPG support in the Galil plugin.  The MPGs that normally plug into a parallel port can normally be wired into Galil inputs and AUX encoders to run the MPG directly on the Galil.  No latency what so ever and it has very smooth and precise MPG movements.

I have one similar to this:  http://www.cnc4pc.com/Store/osc/product_info.php?cPath=40&products_id=162  I don't remember where I got it.  But it looks the same.

It works really well.  What I did was buy a DB25 breakout board to wire it directly to the Galil.  It did use up quite a few of my inputs.  But inputs are cheap these days with Pokeys so if you run out, you can get more rather easily.  You ALWAYS wire the encoder wires to an AUX encoder (or spare axis main encoder) input on your Galil though.  Then you make up some brain files that turn on MPG jog mode, select the increment, and select the the axis to be moved via the inputs.

While that is not as simple as plugging a MPG into a USB port or a parallel port, it is really not that bad of a job.  And you will get the best MPG movement you can possibly have.