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Messages - zmajmr

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11
If you are fixed on a sw solution so be it ... I wish you all the best.
 
IMO, your 25mm (+/-) peck depth is a bit excessive considering the results you are experiencing.
That's producing a BIG birdnest between each retract.
Drilling 75mm (+/-) deep might perform better with more frequent pecks.

Just something I would experiment with.
Good luck to you, my friend,
Russ



Hi, here is video , just to get idea how I drilled until I figured out how many pecks is needed and until I decide to add 15 seconds pauses after every peck with 14 mm (there is no pauses shown in video) end mill so I can clean long chips from end mill and also , I show "system" and example where it is possible to see how it stopped boring operation safely.

https://youtu.be/b6eO-k6hoyw

After every attempt I improved something until I got G code where nothing will be stalled, I only need to clean chips from end mill and like I said I add feed information with every G01 but manually (so just in case "system" is triggered I can contine from where I stopped) , so will try to make to postprocessor do that instead of me. When you make holes wit endmill, endmill need to be aligned pretty good with axis of spindle otherwise is chatters , so when you remove it in and out until it gets in contact with material it makes nasty sound so less pecks better for my ears , this is why I only have 3 pecks, for pilot hole with 8.5 mm drill which is not shown in video I have 26 pecks, but I was not concentrating on machining process so this is why there is no all that in video, I also cut of out of video those noises to save your ears :)
Anyway thx to all you guys for help, if I manage to make post processor to "spit" code as I want that will be next video.

12
Hi zmajmr.
I hope you find the solution that works for you. Mach3 "is what it is" and will never be troubleshot or developed further.
I'm sorry I can't help you with that part.

I did not notice the peck in your video.
Maybe you could try a peck with full retract cycle in order to keep the tool and the bore clean ?
All I can offer is various machining strategies.
Regards,
Russ

Hi Russ one more time, I know that Mach 3 will not be developed further because Mach 4 exist, I was trying to find out do I wrote something in wrong format (I am talking about Gcode) so that is maybe  reason why is this happening or is it possible to edit something in Mach 3, some function by me, something I do not know, that is it, mainly I was expecting to hear what I could do software wise.  You are right you probably did not see end mill how it goes in and out because I remove it out of tool changer for testing purposes but If you read G code from example you will see that starting point is Z = 1 mm and endmil enters 3 time out of part untill it rich full depth.
Will try to edit postprocesor from CAM that I am using to generate  G01 together with Feed value and will use Mach 3 like that, main thing that everything work as I expect, more letters on screen will not hurt me or my computer :) Will make short video about drilling hole.

13
FYI Nobody watches a 36 minute video.
I assume that majority will not watch 36 min video, I posted 4 minute video before that 36 min and i conclude even 4 minute is to long concluding from what I can read in topic, but if somebody will have or will be aware of problems like I do maybe it will watch 36 min video, 4 min video is part from 36 min video where I basically talk about all what is written here. I also do not watch videos about thing that do not interests me but if video is about that will solve my problems I will watch it FYI.

14
A few things you could try to eliminate the problem and negate the work-around.

Adjust the speed/feed rates  (power permitting)
Generate chips instead of a bird nest.
More appropriate tooling (2 flute ?)
Pilot hole ?
Change drilling strategy (peck)

Similarly: If turning the OD and stalling the spindle, I'd adjust the doc, feed and speed appropriately to match the machines capabilities instead of the approach you are taking.

Kind regards,
Russ

Hi Russ, yes this is work around what you suggest, even how I bore holes like this is work around how I initially started, I bore 8.5 mm pilot hole and used carbide boring bar to increase inside bore, and I was stalling spindle because of chips built inside of hole which is deep. So I changed strategy, made spindle overload protection about I talked in topic to protect tools.  So in video that is possible to see I already bore 8.5 mm pilot hole, then bored 12 mm hole with 4 flute endmill and after that bore with 4 flute 14 mm end mill. I am using peck drilling, I even made pauses where after few peck I  clean end mill. So machining process is not problem for me, problems is that I ran complicated programs then this from example and saw that weird things are going on when I pause feed or stop program and I want to continue where I stopped. As it all develops pretty fast in front of screen you are not sure did you think that something is going on strange or you just think that you made it up and probably everything is Ok. So just to be on safe side I rewind program in most cases and start from zero and that means spending lot of time cutting air. So now when I finally mange to see on simple example what is going on I am trying to figure out is it possible to make something in mach 3 in order to solve that problem or I will edit post processor to generate feed value for every G01 command (which I still did not mange to do).

My machine have 1.5 kW motor , originally it was around 4 Kw motor  but when I bough machine it came with 1.5 kw so I left it , so motor could be stronger but that is not what interests me, I am asking about software solution of problem if it exist. Anyway thank you for help, and yes I have also bird nest and they prevent coolant to get inside deep in hole,so this is why I made also spindle protection system. When I turn OD I can use higher RPM and motor then have more torque so there I do not have problems.

15
I made longer video where I show everything about I talked in this topic, what are problems and what I can do to resolve problem because I do not understand what to change in Mach 3 https://youtu.be/nUJe-3X-VJw

If somebody have more ideas please let me know.

16

And why I need instant stop, because I do not want to break tools, inserts ,displace toolchanger , Feed hold is just to slow for what I need it.
When you drill hole you can stall spindle if there is to many chips in hole and hole is deep and there no time to wait for Feed hold to take action, if spindle stops all axis need to stop also same millisecond. And when I clean hole I do not want to run program from begging because that is wast of time, I want to continue where I stopped , few mm +/-  .


IMHO, The part in bold would be an example of when an e-stop could be used - you see a situation arising, it needs to stop, now! The answer is - press the big red button.

After that is what matters though - i would never attempt a quick restart after an e-stop, i would certainly re-ref the machine, check my co-ordinates, note the code line i stopped on, fix the issue and use run-from-here, unless near the start of the code where i would just run through the code again.


Hi, you are definitely right that is situation when Estop can be used , imagine now system that will automatically stop spindle and movement of axis , you just need to decide at which RPM you still allow movement of drilling tool into work piece, for example if you drill something with 1000 RPM, and everything above 700 RPM is good, if RPM drops below 700 RPM everything should stop automatically in same second, this is how I did it https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qaacj7kBw1s

So I do not need to see anything, just need to decide @ which RPM level  everything need to stop because it is not safe to continue, after that remove tool out, clean hole and continue.
After E stop I usually reload Gcode because have toolchanger  as y axis (and x and z are regular axis for lathe)  so sometimes my tools are messed up after E stop, this is why I prefer Stop file option, it is fast and no need to RESET and reload G code program, with one command/button I shut down spindle and all axis.

17
Does not the Gcode FR  display in the window to the right?  Set manually if needed.

Hi, I do not understand what you say/think/ask.

I can set manually feed but need to go back to manual  mode (do not like that idea).

18
If you read the manual it will TELL you what STOP does. You can NOT continue from there. It is equivalent to an external eStop.
Yes, Feed Hold can take a while to execute, because there is stuff in the pipeline, AND the halt is subject to the deceleration for the motors.
No use complaining that the CNC does not do what you want when what you want is even more dangerous! Hit Stop and the spindle stops. Hit Cycle Start and there is NO M3 to turn the spindle back on.

You do NOT need to put a F40 at the end of every line. Just one F40 on a line by itself where you want the speed change is quite enough.

Cheers
Roger

Hi Roger, I assume you did not watched 4 minute video in my post above yours.

So to clear things (I read manual and conclusion is that I need to test everything because I can read something and in reality /practice I see that something does not exist or does not work, do not have list of those things but in last 4 - 5 years I saw those kind of things while I was using Mach 3).

So from my experience you can use STOP and you can continue from point where you stopped BUT off course you need manually to TURN ON spindle and select appropriate rotation (M3 or M4) , you do not need to set Spindle RPM again, it is saved .

Diffrence between Stop file and E stop is that after E stop I need to press RESET  and rewind program, with Stop file I do not need press RESET and I can continue from point where I stopped but need to have appropriate feedrate , need to TURN ON spindle and select appropriate rotation.  

So as I mentioned in posts before problem is that Mach3 does not continue with feed with which I stopped no matter if I chose Feed hold or Stop File . If I use G code in this version:

N20 G21 G18 G64 G80 G90 M48 G90.1 G40 G49
N30 M08
; TOOL definition
N50 T0909
N60 G00 X0.0 Z10.0
N70 G49
N80 ( End Mill  12mm Dia )
N90 T0202
N100 G00 X0.0 Z5.0
N110 G97 S1000
N120 M04 G94 F40.0
N130 G00 Z1.0
N140 G01 Z-24.633
N150 G00 Z1.0
N160 Z-23.633
N170 G01 Z-49.267
N180 G00 Z1.0
N190 Z-48.267
N200 G01 Z-73.9
N210 G00 Z1.0
N220 M05 M09
N230 M30

There is no problem, my feed rate will be F40 no matter if I use Feed hold or Stop file but if I use G code in this version:

N20 G21 G18 G64 G80 G90 M48 G90.1 G40 G49
N30 M08
; TOOL definition
N50 T0909
N60 G00 X0.0 Z10.0
N70 G49
N80 ( End Mill  12mm Dia )
N90 T0202
N100 G00 X0.0 Z5.0
N110 G97 S1000
N120 M04 G94 F40.0
N130 G00 Z1.0
N140 G01 Z-24.633
N150 G00 Z1.0
N160 Z-23.633
N170 G01 Z-49.267
N180 G00 Z1.0
N190 Z-48.267
N200 G01 Z-73.9
N205 S300 F300
N210 G01 Z1.0
N220 M05 M09
N230 M30

notice line N205 and N210

and for example I activate Feed hold button @ line N140  Mach 3 for some reason set Feed to be 300 mm/ min just because I add line

N205 S300 F300

and I just want to retract with feed F300 , not with rapid feedrate.

And to confirm that there is no problems if I use G code in this shape :

N20 G21 G18 G64 G80 G90 M48 G90.1 G40 G49
N30 M08
; TOOL definition
N50 T0909
N60 G00 X0.0 Z10.0
N70 G49
N80 ( End Mill  12mm Dia )
N90 T0202
N100 G00 X0.0 Z5.0
N110 G97 S1000
N120 M04 G94 F40.0
N130 G00 Z1.0
N140 G01 Z-24.633 F40.0
N150 G00 Z1.0
N160 Z-23.633
N170 G01 Z-49.267 F40.0
N180 G00 Z1.0
N190 Z-48.267
N200 G01 Z-73.9 F40.0
N205 S300 F300
N210 G01 Z1.0
N220 M05 M09
N230 M30

So I am not complaining, I am wondering why Mach 3 does not work correctly even when I use Feed hold to  stop  at line N140.

And why I need instant stop, because I do not want to break tools, inserts ,displace toolchanger , Feed hold is just to slow for what I need it.
When you drill hole you can stall spindle if there is to many chips in hole and hole is deep and there no time to wait for Feed hold to take action, if spindle stops all axis need to stop also same millisecond. And when I clean hole I do not want to run program from begging because that is wast of time, I want to continue where I stopped , few mm +/-  .

Hope now is everything better understood.





19
Don't use the stop button, use feed hold. Using the stop button requires you to start over.Feed hold pauses the motion.You can then turn off the spindle, do what you need to do and then hit cycle start.

Mike
Hi Mike, there was situations where I used feed hold in past , thing why I do not like to use it is because it stops with movement of axis when Mach decide, sometimes it is 1 second , sometimes 2 or 3 seconds. If there is no danger of destroying your tool (there is nothing that will stall your spindle) then you can use Feed Hold but when you want immediately stop everything then you need to use Stop File or E Stop. For given G code example I went to try what will happen even if i use Feed Hold and result was not good. Only thing that helped was that I edited manually G code (given example) and every G01 command contains feed command, for example line N140 G01 Z-24.633 looks like this after my edit N140 G01 Z-24.633 F40 and after edit  there is no problems no matter if I use feed hold or stop file, only that stop file, stops movement of axis same second. Here is video of test if somebody is interested https://youtu.be/VSHC9O4CVrA

So if nobody does not have more ideas my only solution is to find out how to edit post processor to generate feedrate information with every G01 command.

20
Hi community, I have little problem / question.

I will give you real example , that will be G code for drilling process

N20 G21 G18 G64 G80 G90 M48 G90.1 G40 G49
N30 M08
; TOOL definition
N50 T0909
N60 G00 X0.0 Z10.0
N70 G49
N80 ( End Mill  12mm Dia )
N90 T0202
N100 G00 X0.0 Z5.0
N110 G97 S1000
N120 M04 G94 F40.0
N130 G00 Z1.0
N140 G01 Z-24.633
N150 G00 Z1.0
N160 Z-23.633
N170 G01 Z-49.267
N180 G00 Z1.0
N190 Z-48.267
N200 G01 Z-73.9
N210 G00 Z1.0
N220 M05 M09
N230 M30

Lets imagine spindle "feels" to much load at line N140 and Stop file is triggered /pressed, at line N120 there is command that sets feed at 40 mm/ min and when I resume with executing G code machine will continue with feed 40 mm/ minute (after I clean chips, press M4 manually and press Cycle start).

Now thing is when my endmill completed job of drilling hole I want to be retracted @ 300 RPM and Feed 300mm/min so I made little change in G code

N20 G21 G18 G64 G80 G90 M48 G90.1 G40 G49
N30 M08
; TOOL definition
N50 T0909
N60 G00 X0.0 Z10.0
N70 G49
N80 ( End Mill  12mm Dia )
N90 T0202
N100 G00 X0.0 Z5.0
N110 G97 S1000
N120 M04 G94 F40.0
N130 G00 Z1.0
N140 G01 Z-24.633
N150 G00 Z1.0
N160 Z-23.633
N170 G01 Z-49.267
N180 G00 Z1.0
N190 Z-48.267
N200 G01 Z-73.9
N205 S300 F300
N210 G01 Z1.0
N220 M05 M09
N230 M30

notice line N205 and N210

Now , if I activate Stop file button at line N140 as in example above and I clean chips, press manually M4 , Cycle start it is logical to me that Mach3 resume/ continue from where it stopped with executing G code with feedrate @ everything was stopped, BUT it will resume with Feed 300 mm/min.

Now I would like to know why, and is it possible to change something in order to that not be like that (edit some function, or do I write my Gcode wrong, it can be very dangerous and I become aware of that before few days ago even I use my CNC lathe for some time and I saw that something strange is going on but never succeed to define what is going on because all my programs are created with CAM and are much longer then this simple example.

I even made 10 minute video where I described what is going.

It came to my mind to try to edit post processor to generate with every G01 command Feed value , so will have redundancy , did not succeed yet with that idea so I am wondering do I do something wrong, and what is usual thing to do.

I can after every Stop of executing Gcode press Rewind button and start G code from line zero (start) but that is waste of time because usually 90 % of job is done already and I would cut air  90% of time.

Here is video

https://youtu.be/eYbE-kntcss

Thank you in advance for any help or idea, suggestions or something else  :)


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