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Messages - joeaverage

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2751
Hi,
kool....can I order a waterproof one to put in the mother-in-laws bath? ;D

Craig

2752
General Mach Discussion / Re: Mirror probing
« on: March 30, 2019, 07:50:45 PM »
Hi,
yes, up to four probes is common to both Mach4Industrial and Mach4Hobby.

I might point out that I feel sure something could be cobbled together in Mach3 just as well, its just I'm not sure
how. Changing to Mach4 on this basis alone might be dubious.

Craig

2753
General Mach Discussion / Re: Mirror probing
« on: March 30, 2019, 07:31:01 PM »
Hi,
that is quite a complex shape and so I would guess that simply probing in the Z axis direction would
not be good enough.

Yes if you rotate the barrel OR alternately the probe then you would get better results. The data collected would
form a 3D point cloud. That gets away from the rather simple G31 probe command.
I'm not saying it cant be done but that extra complexity will give you cause for thought.

My strength is Mach4 and with Mach4 you can have up to four probes. What I would do is have one probe
operate normally, ie vertically and two others operating at 900 to the first ie horizontally,
one in the positive Y direction and one in the negative Y direction.

To my knowledge all three probe point data would still end up in the one probe file and would constitute the
raw data for a 3D point cloud.

How you would go about that in Mach3 is a little more problematic. I suspect it could be done but I would
defer to Mach3 gurus.

Craig

2754
Mach4 General Discussion / Re: How do I make the Extents mode visible
« on: March 30, 2019, 07:08:26 PM »
Hi,
there was a time with earlier builds of Mach that allowed you to change colours of the various traces on the
tool path diagram. I don't recall be able to set the style, ie dashed or continuous and you weren't able to set the
line weight.

The most recent builds of Mach have taken away the colour pallet. I'm not sure how you go about adjusting the line weight
or whether you can adjust the style.

Craig

2755
General Mach Discussion / Re: Mirror probing
« on: March 30, 2019, 06:59:29 PM »
Hi Don,
OK that makes sense.

I see a couple of challenges that might occur if you probe the barrel.
First I imagine for a solder joint to be effective accuracy is important, say less than 0.001".
If you were to probe in the Z direction accuracy of the probe data would be good at and around the centerline
of the surface but accuracy would degrade as you approached the flanks of the surface. If that loss of
accuracy is a problem then the probe axis would have to be rotated such that it was approximately at
right angles to the surface.

That would not be insurmountable but adds considerable complexity.

How 'far around' the barrel does the quarter rib have to extend?

Craig

2756
Hi Gerry,

Quote
Also, the VFD stores power in capacitors, which the spindle draws from. It shouldn't be sending voltage back through the electrical system.

You are correct, the only way the charge stored in the capacitors to get back into the power supply would be a catastrophic
failure of the input rectifier bridge.

What that does not accommodate is the natural inductance of the supply.

If the load (VFD or whatever) suddenly increases its current draw the voltage will dip. Part of the dip will be the resistance
of the supply, we hope its small but we know its there. The other part of the voltage dip is caused by the inductance
of the power supply. Even a straight wire has an inductance and the secondary of the distribution transformer will
have both magnetizing reactance and leakage inductance. The net result of the wiring and the distribution transformer
is a residual inductance commonly of the order of 1mH.

Lets now imagine the load which had been drawing 20A from the supply sudden stops drawing current, lets say you threw
open the switch, then the inductance will mean that the current cannot stop immediately an a marked increase in voltage
in the supply will result.

In high power electronic circuits where large currents are switched on and off extremely quickly the residual inductance
of the power supply can cause very high voltage spikes.

Take a single phase VFD for instance. The incoming line voltage is 230VAC(rms), its rectified and capacitively
smoothed to 320VDC. At a given instant one of the MOSFET's is conducting 20A and it switches off. The current
will stop within, and ideally, less that 1 microsecond. The inductance of the input supply will cause a voltage spike
(without control or precaution) of another 300V or so. Your nice rugged industrial grade 500V MOSFET has now
a voltage spike of 620VDC to contend with. Whats more the same MOSFET will turn on and off rapidly, say 50,000
times a second, so it gets repeated hits and promptly blows up.

The voltage spikes due to residual inductance are very troublesome to the design engineer who has to design and
implement snubber circuits. Indeed the reliability of the equipment depends on it. Often the quality of the design
can be estimated by the effectiveness and ruggedness of the components used in the snubber circuits.

The upshot is that it is not impossible for the current drawn by a VFD to cause a very high voltage spike which
could easily damage other equipment like PC's connected to the same circuit. I like you have my VFD connected
to the same outlet as my PC and stepper supplies and have not encountered any difficulty. It is only a 750W VFD
however and I treat pretty lightly as a rule.

More recently I made another spindle based on a 1.8kW AC servo with a single phase 10A output/phase servo drive.
I give it hell......and found that I was getting conducted noise issues through the common supply. Nothing blew up but
I think I would have if I'd carried on. What I did was fit a line reactor and all those issues went away and seemed incidentally
to improve the servo drives overload capacity.

That OP managed not just have a voltage spike but a surge enough to take out all other stuff connected to the same circuit,
PC, stepper supplies etc suggests a rather bigger fault than a regular voltage spike. I don't recall ever having seen
a 110V VFD. What is it about them that causes them to be troublesome?

Craig


2757
Mach4 General Discussion / Re: How do I make the Extents mode visible
« on: March 30, 2019, 05:33:56 PM »
Hi,
have you tried the <Display Work Envelope> button?

The work envelope is determined by the values you set in the soft limits.

Craig

2758
Mach4 General Discussion / Re: Mach4 Parallel Port Legacy Plugin
« on: March 30, 2019, 05:25:44 PM »
Hi,

Quote
Yes I am. The reason for the upgrade would be for the lathe. Mach3 Lathe isn't all that great so I would like to upgrade to Mach4. I run both a lathe and mill from the same computer so I would need 2 motion cards and the software and the driver. After tax, title, and delivery i would have to spend north of 650 bucks to upgrade a $1200 mill and $1400 lathe. I would also have to spend the time to rewire the panel. Not worth the trouble. If it were a simple software upgrade for $250 bucks I would be on board right now. It's just not worth the trouble and expense to have better screens for one of the 2 machines. I'm not knocking Mach4 but there isn't anything in it for me when both machines are running great other than a better looking gui. I just don't need any of the other funtions.

I personally think that Steve's reply is a perfect example of why Mach4 is not being taken up by Mach3 users in greater
numbers. He has a working solution already and the cost, approx. $650 in his case, to get just one of his machines into
Mach4 is too steep. He also comments ' there isn't anything in it for me when both machines are running great other than
a better looking gui. I just don't need any of the other funtions'. Steve clearly regards Mach4 as a software upgrade with
a better GUI only and no other features that he requires.

I think his comments and opinions are spot on.

My opinion is that Mach4 is a new product, not an upgrade. The new product has really only recently offered new
functionality that the older product (mach3) does not, although the programming flexibility of the new product
well exceeds the older product. As such there has been little incentive for people to buy new, Steve for example.

When or if Steve determines that Mach4 offers functionality that Mach3 cant AND he WANTS those features THEN he will
buy new.

As everyone is aware I am a rabid Mach4 supporter and feel,  mistakenly, that modest uptake of Mach4 by others
smacks as a negative against the software. Modest uptake among existing Mach users simply indicates that there
is nothing extra appealing about Mach4 to induce them to buy new.

Guess what? That's perfectly OK. Mach4 has recently added Surface Map, a script based THC solution and a teach
function intended for plasma ops. These features do not exist in Mach3. I am now of the opinion that Mach4 exceeds
the functionality of Mach3 and anticipate that more users will migrate to it as these and other developments are
released that make Mach4 genuinely more capable than Mach3.

Craig

2759
General Mach Discussion / Re: Mirror probing
« on: March 30, 2019, 04:42:01 PM »
Hi,
I assume from your description that you are using a lathe?

You need to turn a part to mate with a convex mirror?

Probing you may be surprised is remarkably easy and you can make an adequate probe yourself without spending
anything. It occurs to me you could try it without a great deal of expense or time.

Can you explain a bit more about what you are doing?
Can the convex surface be mounted in your machine to probe it?

Craig

2760
General Mach Discussion / Re: Mach 3 Threading Hangs
« on: March 30, 2019, 04:32:49 PM »
Hi,
I have no experience with threading so cannot offer a solution.

I do now however that the LED on the diagnostics screen will never be able to keep pace with the index signal.
It sounds like you have made considerable effort to ensure a clean index signal and that the index LED operates
as it should when turned by hand. Even more, when running that the spindle speed should be accurately displayed
and feed per turn work correctly all suggest that the index signal is good notwithstanding the intermittent operation
of the LED.

Craig

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