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Messages - joeaverage

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2421
Mach4 General Discussion / Re: SSR Relay Forward Reverse Help
« on: June 10, 2019, 11:35:01 AM »
Hi,
you need double pole double throw to reverse a DC motor.

Your SSR is single pole single throw, ie you'd require four of them.

Craig

2422
Mach4 General Discussion / Re: Mach4, Esc key to stop program running
« on: June 10, 2019, 03:16:41 AM »
Hi,
yes I can see how that code works, it has the advantage of simplicity but is woefully inefficient.

Mach is designed to use a signal library called SigLib in the screenload script. I wrote an introductory .pdf  about using
the signal library:
https://www.machsupport.com/forum/index.php?topic=40051.msg267764#msg267764

Craig

2423
Hi,

Quote
Thinking maybe I ought to try the Mach 4 demo, just to see if that fixes it.

Nice thought but.......no it wont fix it. The problem you have described is not a Mach (3 or 4) fault but a fault with your
X axis, be it a stepper or driver or binding axis or whatever.

Craig

2424
General Mach Discussion / Re: mach3 milling errors
« on: June 10, 2019, 03:05:38 AM »
Hi,
you have too many variables going on.

I'm beginning to think that your steps/per are wrong.

Do you use inches or mm?

If you zero the Xaxis and MDI:

g1 x100 f200 (this assumes mm units)

does the axis move exactly 100mm? Repeat the test with Y and Z axes.

Craig

2425
Mach4 General Discussion / Re: NOOB Alert (MACH4 & 57CNC Issues)
« on: June 09, 2019, 02:35:30 PM »
Hi,
that sounds like noise on the Dir pin of your Z axis driver.

Are all your steppers driven off that one board as pictured in the video?
Can you tell me the model number of the drive ICs on that board?

Craig

2426
General Mach Discussion / Re: mach3 milling errors
« on: June 09, 2019, 02:18:00 PM »
Hi,
the probability is that you have the jog rate set to only 6% of the traverse rate, its is set at 6% when Mach fires up.

Reduce the max speed and acceleration by half again and then re-try.

What is the inductance of your motors?
What is the voltage of your driver supply?

Craig

2427
Hi,

Quote
1.the encoder is 160,000ppr.
2.you can set the electronic gearing so as to allow your step inputs to be suitable for your controller.

That was my initial impression also....but the more I read I came to the opposite conclusion, namely that you can
program the encoder to have anywhere between 4 and 40,000 lines. It is the synthesized encoder that is used as the
primary feedback and electronic gearing is applied to that....not the 160,000ppr.

Craig

2428
Hi,
page 203 Chapter7

Craig

2429
General Mach Discussion / Re: mach3 milling errors
« on: June 08, 2019, 06:31:23 PM »
Hi,
this is a classic case of one or more axes losing steps.

Stepper motors lose torque the faster they go. A given stepper may have 400oz.in holding torque but only 150oz.in
at 500 rpm and 40oz.in at 1000 rpm. Yes, you read that correctly.....only 10% of its initial torque at 1000 rpm.

First time buyer of steppers tend to buy based on holding torque alone. This is a mistake. The inductance of a stepper
determines how badly it will lose torque as the speed gets up. Thus a 500oz.in stepper with high inductance might have
only 50oz.in at 1000 rpm whereas a 400oz.in low inductance motor might retain 100oz.in at 1000 rpm. Believe it or not
the 400 oz.in motor is the better unit.

Can you post the model of the steppers you have used?

One way to combat the loss of torque as speed goes up is to use a higher voltage supply and driver. What voltage supply
are you using? The drivers (DMA860h) are advertised as being good for 80V so I would have a supply of 72V at least.

In the first instance you need to reduce the maximum velocity  and maximum acceleration of the machine in your motor
tuning to a very slow rate and then slowly increase the velocity (to start with) until you start to lose steps, then back
off 25%. Do the same with acceleration.

Craig

2430
Mach4 General Discussion / Re: Mach4 Information needed from experts
« on: June 08, 2019, 06:09:27 PM »
Hi,
this post would be best placed on the main Mach4 Discussion board, you'll get more replies there.

Mach4 is a CNC control software solution. It takes Gcode, an industry standard code for producing machine movement,
and in conjunction with a motion control board produces pulse streams which in turn control motor drivers which in turn
control the X,Y and Z axes of your machine.

Your question is really in two parts. You ask about Corel Draw, obviously you already use it in your design process? Mach4
does not 'read' Corel Draw but rather it 'reads' GCode.

There are a number of ways to produce Gcode, it can and used to be written by hand, but is these days produced by a CAM
program. A CAM program will take a digital drawing of your design, commonly produced by a CAD program, but also able
in many cases to accept designs from drawing programs like Corel Draw and convert it into a series of machine moves
which can then be presented to Mach4 and your machine.

Fully fledged professional CAM programs are expensive.....very expensive. Mastercam is one of the oldest and best CAM programs,
a fully featured copy could be as much as $20,000 plus a $2500 annual fee! You probably don't need anything like that,
there are many 2D and 2.5D CAM programs for under $1000.

Another CAD/CAM program that has become very popular amongst hobbyists is Fusion 360 because its free to hobbyists/students
and start-ups. It is fully featured and altogether pretty darn good. Even if you find a better solution I certainly recommend you
download it and try it out. Its made and supported by Autodesk, the same company who make AutoCAD, Inventor and HSMWorks.
Clearly their intention is to showcase their CAD/CAM software to attract new customers. Fusion 360 is very good
advertising material.

Mach4 runs on a PC, just about any PC will do, its not a particularly 'hungry' program. It produces numeric data which is
communicated to a motion controller, most commonly over a Ethernet cable, then via a breakout board to the motor drivers.
I use an Ethernet SmoothStepper made by Warp9TD. There are other worthy examples like PMDX-424, UC300, 57CNC and
Hicon Integra. They range in price from about $150 to about $600. The Ethernet SmoothStepper (ESS) is in the middle at $190.
It requires a breakout board ( a amplifier/buffer to protect the ESS and connect to the wiring of the drives), which can be
had for as little as $25 up to $200 depending on the features you want.

Just as an example:

PC- entry level Laptop     $500
Mach4Hobby                   $200      (Mach4Industrial is an option $1400)
ESS                               $190
MB03 breakout board      $180       (fully featured breakout board by CNCRoom)

TOTAL                            $1070

I suggest you look on the NFS website to find some videos of Mach working.

The machine is likely to be very much more expensive than PC/Mach4/Breakout Board.

It is common for hobbyists machines to use stepper motors for the axis motors because they are cheap. For your situation
with a large machine you will probably require AC servos and could easily spend $500 per axis.

Rolled ballscrews are an economical way of producing linear movement from the rotational movement of the axis motors.
They are accurate to about 0.05mm over 300mm. They are lightly preloaded so there is no backlash. Up to about 1m in
length you could get them for about $200 each. If you require better accuracy then you need ground  (C5 or even C3) ballscrews
which are $2000 plus each.

As you can see if you require very good accuracy, as would be expected in a CNC machining center the cost goes up
enormously.

You will require linear guides or some other 'rail' or method to guide the axes. You might get away with round rails a linear bearings
but the flexure is going to count against your accuracy. I would recommend rectangular rails and preloaded recirculating ball bearing
cars.

A Hiwin (Taiwainese) 15mm square rail and two heavy duty cars say 1m long would be around $150.

Just as an example, this is the cost breakdown for the components of three axis gantry type machine with slave Y axis
and servos on all four ballscrews, approx. size 1m x 1m

4 x 400W AC servos                                      $2000
3x  1200 mm rolled ballscrews  (X and 2 Y)     $600
1x 400mm rolled ballscrew (Z)                       $150
6x 15mm square rails/2xHD cars (2X and 4Y)  $600
2x 15mm square rails/2xHD cars (2Z)             $200

TOTAL                                                          $3550

Note this does not include the steel frame and gantry nor does it include the spindle. As you can see just the cost of good motion
components well exceed the cost PC/Mach/ESS/BoB.

I have no doubt you could reduce the cost of the components, for instance substituting steppers for servos, and roller bearings
instead of recirculating ball bearing cars/rails. At each cost saving decision you trade cost verses accuracy/rigidity/speed. You will
have to weigh carefully the initial cost of components against the potential of this machine to make money......penny pinching
at the outset may cost you operational efficiency/money making potential in the longer term.

Craig

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