Hello Guest it is April 25, 2024, 05:46:49 PM

Show Posts

This section allows you to view all posts made by this member. Note that you can only see posts made in areas you currently have access to.


Messages - simpson36

1291
General Mach Discussion / Re: Motors stalling, losing steps
« on: February 06, 2009, 04:53:25 AM »
Couple observations:

First, you have the motor set up parallel which is 4.2 amps. The 540 drive specs at 3.5 max

Second, your resistor is off by a factor of 1,000

You might consider wiring the motors as series and note the 'K' (thousand) next to the resistor ohm spec.

1292
Bob,

Couple tips . . .

To reduce the power needed and the flex on your single point cuts:

1) Sharpen the tool. Your photo shows a tool sharpened with a pretty rough wheel. You need a razor edge and a min 7 degree negative rake for that brass. While it is not a necessity, but you could benefit from using some cutting fluid also.

2) increase the spindle speed . . . a lot . . . . I mean . . . .  a LOT

3) I don't know how the wizards or the Gcode macros function, but you can reduce thepower required significantly by only cutting one side of the 'V', if that is doable with the wizard/macro.


For cutting those tiny threads on soft material, unless you are doing it for the pleasure and/or the challenge, you should consider just getting a die holder for your tail stock and cut your threads with a die . . . much easier and faster.

1293
Rich,

Thx for the link. This excerpt from Art's explanation defines what I was talking about exactly:

"The second possability is a slightly varying index pulse in time.Ive seen
many sensors, ( my own included) that cause RPM variations due to being too
sensitive and varying in time from pulse to pulse. Adjusting sensitivity
solved my own issue with that."


I'll read thru the entire thread when I have more time.


Hood,

Thanks again! Obviously I have to do some more homework on the Smooth . . .  uh . . . 'driver' board before discounting it! Thinking a bit further thru the idea, the servo drivers from Gecko (for example)  take the same inputs as their stepper driver? And SS is generating those inputs, so it does not care what is being driven? Is that basically the crux of it?


BTW< I commend you both for infinite patience with an endless stream of stupid questions from we newbees.

1294
Hood,

Thx.

I wasn't considering 'timing' vs 'index' in terms of Mach3 specific vernacular.

As I read it, 'timing' is theoretically better, which is what I was thinking, particularly at slow rotations. However, the real world limitation is the PP and granularity at 25khz, which is also understandable.

For steppers, I'm learning more and more advantages to the Smooth Stepper.

When I do another conversion, it will be with servos, so I won't be able to benefit from that piece of technology, but I find it interesting none-the-less.



1295
Bob
Sounds like Mach is not seeing the Index properly if it is jittering about like that.

Simpson
 Art did a bit of a write up regarding Index versus Timing , if I remember correctly ,  it all boiled down to if anything Index was best.

Hood

Hood, can you elaborate on this or point me to the writeup?

1296
Wow, this is turning in to quite a thread . . . yuck, yuck.

There are two ways to single point threads; a straight plunge, or cutting only one side of the 'V', which I would imagine would be far better for the 'puny' lathes. In either case, backlash is irrelevant as you always cut in the same direction. Your error far exceeds the backlash so it would be an academic discussion even if you were improperly cutting the 'near' side of the 'V' where backlash might come into play.

Having seen the picture of your pulse trigger setup, I believe that is your suspect. The color is not as relevant as the surface, I would imagine. You have shiny tape on a small radius. It is probably only slightly less reflective than the shaft itself. Perhaps even more so to IR light.  You can see the highlight on the shiny black tape even in your photo. That's also probably what the sensor is seeing.

To support the consensus, I'll add that I also use a slotted disk. Single round hole of about 1/4" dia. Mach seems extremely accurate picking up deviations of a few RPM at speeds over 6,000 and also reading steady at slow speeds.

My sense is that at very low speeds like 100RPM, more than one slot would be beneficial, but it appears from several people who have posted their successful threading experience, that one pulse is sufficient.

There is enough information now to suggest that moving your black area to the face of the disk instead of the shaft as suggested by RC (Overloaded) would probably solve your problem. You also should use flat black, and not something shiny. Even better, as has also been suggested, go with a slot or blade arrangement for the most positive trigger. 

As a minimum, strip off that shiny tape and spray some flat back paint in it's place,( and you might consider making it significantly narrower as well) - or - (for diagnostics and not as a permanent solution) take some 600 or finer grit wet/dry and at least scuff off that shine!

1297
"When the impossibility has been ELIMINATED, whatever remains, no matter how improbable... is possible."
- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle

We geeky pocket protector types love to quote that . . . but it works . . . so to identify what is NOT causing the problem is useful:

Steppers cannot 'catch up' with lost steps, so eliminating the stepper, lead screw and controllers should be as easy as seeing if the axis returns to their start point after the thread cutting. If they do, then unless I am missing something about how steppers operate, you simply can eliminate the steppers as a suspect.

If your pulse counter is on the spindle with the chuck, then you can eliminate belt slippage as a cause since that would show up immediately in the chuck speed.

The way I read it, you are considering replacing the spindle motor with a stepper. Is that correct? If so, forget about that idea. You can't compare  the power available from a stepper and from your spindle motor in terms of torque.

I'll try to explain, but most people have a lot of trouble with these concepts:

How much you can cut is going to be determined by how much POWER you have available.

Torque is not POWER.

Torque is a STATIC measurement of twisting force.  POWER (often expressed as horse power), is a measurement of work done over TIME.

The term 'work' involves movement, the force is given as torque and the distance is RPM.

A stepper producing 200 oz in of torque at 400RPM is not producing anywhere near the power of the spindle producing the same 200oz-in at 6,000RPM.

A formula:  RPM * TORQUE (in ft-ibs)/ 5252 = HP   

so . . power at the chuck:   Stepper  .0793   vs   Spindle motor 1.19   

Same torque spec, yet 15 times more power.

Sorry this info won't solve your threading problem, but I think it is relevant to a proposed solution that's been contemplated. Hope it helps.










1298
I don;t think anyone has asked if you are running the 'evaluation' version of the software.

If so, single point threading is disabled and you will simply waste more time and materials until you eventually discover that the feature is crippled  . . . as I did.

I have evaluated and then purchased a lot of software, but this is the first time I've come across a 'demo' version that does not make clear exactly what is crippled, leaving the evaluator wasting many valuable hours chasing unsolvable problems. Very annoying. Unconscionable actually, in my opinion.

1299
General Mach Discussion / Re: "Limit Switch Triggered"
« on: January 16, 2009, 04:35:50 AM »

Presumably this thread is concluded, so this is officially not a hijack.



Thanks, maybe reciprocation? Hope I can help....
WAC

Send cash . . large stacks of unmarked 20's to:

Worthy Charity
My house
Texass

We take only a modest 92% 'administrative fee' and the rest goes directly to help under privileged Wall Street CEO's


Hood,

I see you are from Scotland. Simpson is a branch of Clan Fraser from the Loch Ness region. I learned this at a genealogy booth at my first highland games. You know, extra large burly-man types wearing skirts and competing to throw ridiculously huge objects the furthest. That's a story in itself . . for another time.




1300
General Mach Discussion / Re: "Limit Switch Triggered"
« on: January 15, 2009, 05:17:30 PM »
Hood, too funny!!

But . . . still wrong!

The current strategy is to mount the mill on the wall, I believe . . . . unless I missed something while I was on . . . break . . . . in the garden . . . . uh . . harvesting . . .  ;D

BTW, I tried it once in college, . . but I didn't inhale . . .  ::)