Messages

11

Mach4 General Discussion / Re: The great screen debate

« on: August 26, 2015, 05:49:02 AM »

Touch screens are NICE but they also require larger screen elements(buttons) to safely use.  control keys/buttons have worked for about 40 years now no reason they still can't.

Touch screens do need bigger 'buttons' and there are no physical barriers between them to help prevent pressing the adjacent button accidentally.

Another argument against touch screens is that you need a stylus or bare finger to operate them.

There are solutions to both of these drawbacks and touch screens operable by a gloved finger can be made in such a way that it is impossible to press two adjacent buttons at the same time.

However, to my knowledge, there is currently no convenient solution to the fragile nature of the membrane of the resistive type overlays.


On a console with physical controls, if there are say 20 key combinations that perform different functions, how it the content of the keys communicated to the  operator? Is there a display area or keyboard overlay?  If not then would there be a Cheat sheet, or does the  operator just get used to the commands thru use and remember them?

As a long time AutoCAD user, I automatically press the correct function key without even thinking about it . . . well 5 or 6 of them anyway.

It seems there should be some way to combine these methods and take the best of both.

12

Mach4 General Discussion / Re: The great screen debate

« on: August 25, 2015, 07:08:36 AM »

LOL Daniel, just make the screen I want and everyone else can do their own is what I read. LOL  No, in all seriousness, Ill do what I can.

Hows this for a simple screen? Its what I use and all I need. Thanks Hood!

So, is this Chaoticone's  or Hood's screen?    I don't know about this . . .  Looking pretty fancy to me 

Very cool looking 3D buttons. A little bling never hurts.

I don't think it is useful to suggest where to place this button or that because it is going top boil down to personal preference, but as a general guideline, I think it *might* be better to group the operational buttons together and the nav buttons together, rather than mixing them in the same area.

Navigation buttons should all be in the same grouping and there should be either a blank space or a 'spare' button for use in adding more 'pages' to the stock menu.

Operational buttons should be in a fixed position so that an operator does not waste precious seconds hunting for a button, but nav buttons are a good place to conserve real estate by using pop-ups for controls that are only used infrequently and with the operators full attention.

Also consider that the screen should be fairly bland while the machine is operating with no problems. It is more difficult to draw the attention of a user to a specific place if the screen is loaded with bright colors.

13

Mach4 General Discussion / Re: The great screen debate

« on: August 24, 2015, 05:48:52 PM »

MACH4 NEEDS to stay focused on FUNCTION not form.

Apparently I was not the only one with this misconception, so at the risk of getting my wrist slapped  . . .  again . . I think people should be made aware that the core developers are not being re-directed so making fancy (or not-so-fancy) screens.  That was my interpretation based on what I read.

Happily, I report that I was wrong and I don't know why this has not been made clear, but this screen initiative is being done by others and the core guys are doing core stuff . .  as they should be.

AND  . . my apologies if I contributed to giving anyone an impression otherwise.

OK, that's cleared up . . carry on
  

14

Mach4 General Discussion / Re: The great screen debate

« on: August 24, 2015, 03:49:45 PM »

I have never seen a widescreen on a commercial controller. Well I do know of 1 but it is turned sideways for a standard width extra LONG look.

You really need to consider the MOUSELESS approach as most machine do not HAVE or some do NOT allow mouses on a machine tool.

You really need to define who you're designing the screen for.

Most hobbyists want widescreen monitors and mice. My guess is that those people are the majority of your customers.

Commercial machine manufacturers will want something completely opposite.

I agree with this also. Terry hit the nail on the head, in my opinion, with this comment:

...(Mach4 EZ)THEN everyone else can build what they want. There is a big market sector that can build customs for them(;-).e

'Hobby' is the keyword.  There are people like yourself who make screens and vendors can supply screens for their own products. I am working with HiCON controller at the moment and they supply screens for their pendant.

That should be the model for the hobby version. B&B; basic and bulletproof.   

A useful tool to supply would be one that makes it simple to add a screen as a tab. This way, If a hobby user got a custom screen from a vendor or designer, it would be a simple matter to integrate it without having to choose between loosing what he has or gaining something new.

15

Mach4 General Discussion / Re: The great screen debate

« on: August 24, 2015, 03:31:06 PM »

You really need to consider the MOUSELESS approach as most machine do not HAVE or some do NOT allow mouses on a machine tool.

Build a Basic Keyboard enabled screenset (Mach4 EZ)THEN everyone else can build what they want. There is a big market sector that can build customs for them(;-).

This is one of those occasions when I must agree with Terry.  From an operational standpoint, these are the guys that know what works.

My question would be, if no mouse and no physical buttons, are key combinations adequate or should a touch screen be considered?

Also you mentioned tabs.

Assuming a touch screen, would it be better to have a 'menu' , say across the bottom, where you would call up entire recognizable screens or have repositionable pop-ups (i.e. like windows screens) again recognizable, but on screen as long as you need then, placed where you need them, (like not covering the other controls you are using).

-or-

A section of the screen that is perpetually the same and has the most important controls 'in the same place all the time' as you have said in the past, and a separate section (or even a separate screen for that matter) where 'controls of the moment' can be called up and dismissed as needed?

  

16

HiCON Motion Controller / Re: Easy questions on continuous rotation axis

« on: August 24, 2015, 02:31:43 PM »

Marc,

Great idea!  Tell your 'MACH4 guy' I own him a beer . .  an you too of course 

My new pendant has a joystick for jogging  and I use the first two functions for that so I am familiar with those. I have not tried to mapping functions, so that will be an interesting experiment.

I thought about the potential to use the macro capability to spin the 4th axis motor, but things are a bit more complicated than that. The overall feature might be doable with HiCON  macros, but I would say definitely possible in a MACH4 script.

My controller has a feature where it tracks either the Y or Z axis coords and calculates the correct RPM to maintain a commanded SFM. This feature is called 'AutoSpeed' and currently works by collecting the axis coord and passing them over TCP Modbus to the controller where the calculations take place and the DSS is commanded to produce the correct frequency square wave to send to the drive. I'm pretty sure I can duplicate this in a Mach4 script.

The concern there is loading the PLC with a lot of FP calculations on top of a lot of stuff I already have it doing. I could rig a quick test with simuilated nonsense calcs and see what the effect is on the loop time. I will keep you (and 'MACH4 Guy' ) informed if you like.

Thanks for all your help.

- Steve

17

HiCON Motion Controller / Re: Easy questions on continuous rotation axis

« on: August 24, 2015, 01:23:57 PM »

Marc,

Here is an explanation of the process I am asking about:

The question is; with regard to 'spinning an axis motor', can there be more than one motor set up this way?

The reason for that question is that I have a product that is a combination Indexing and Turning 4th axis.

Info here:
www.theInTurn.com

In order to spin this motor, I have a separate motor controller that generated the step stream using a DSS. I suppose in a somewhat similar fashion to the HiCON, my device 'disconnects' the 4th axis servo from MACH in 'lathe' mode and then hands control back to MACH in 'index' mode. MACH is unaware of this.

I have already supplied one of these units integrated with a Mach Motion system, which is where I learned that their system could spin an axis. I did not know at that time that they used Vital Systems hardware. I made a special circuit to disconnect the encoder feedback while the motor controller is spinning the 4th axis (InTurn™) motor just in case the system would fault if it saw the axis moving uncommanded.

Hopefully that is enough background info for you to understand what I am asking about. If the HiCON (or the higher end unit) could spin both the spindle and the 4th axis motors, that would eliminate the need for the independent motor controller.

18

HiCON Motion Controller / Re: HiCON Integra - MACH4 - Servo Spindle - Assigns spindle as slave

« on: August 24, 2015, 01:22:07 PM »

Marc,

Mapping the spindle motor to a 'lettered' axis seems to have solved the problem. It was not clear to me from the manual that this was the correct config and it just never occurred to me to map.

Probably I tried everything possible except that . .  LOL!  (glad I can laugh about it now).

This still leaves one question unanswered and to keep things a bit organized, I will post that to the other thread.

I think I am good to go. Thanks so much!

- Steve

19

HiCON Motion Controller / Re: Easy questions on continuous rotation axis

« on: August 24, 2015, 12:59:27 PM »

I think this may be the confusion.

I do not have the spindle motor mapped to an axis, hence the question about what letter axis the spindle is.

The spindle is mapped to MACH axis OB1

I will try mapping it to the C axis.

This may have answered both questions at once. I will post back

20

HiCON Motion Controller / Re: HiCON Integra - MACH4 - Servo Spindle - Assigns spindle as slave

« on: August 24, 2015, 12:38:29 PM »

Thanks for the response,

Entering 0-10v was just for testing and is not needed.

The motors are all mapped in MACH4 and the highest numbered motor (tried both 4 and 5) are assigned as the spindle in the MACH4 mapping and also from the spindle tab.

The HiCON plug-in is then configured with all motors as Machxx and stepper input. The feed back is left unconfigured

On entry to MACH4 the mapping is correct and the plug in has all of the same settings.

New information: As soon as MACH4 is enabled and disabled again, the mapping is changed to have the spindle  motor assigned as a slave to the first axis. It remains the spindle motor also.
i.e. the motor is remapped immediately and running g-code or any spindle entry in the MDI is not needed. Just clicking the enable button on and off causes the problem.
In case the 64 bit Windows was an issue, I just dis a fresh install of Mach4 v2 2651 and updated the firmware to 3.03 and installed the newest plug-in and configured MACH4 from scratch as described.

As soon as MACH is enabled, the spindle motor is mapped as a slave to the first axis. The .ini file is also updated to show the slave on axis 0

As I read the last line of your post, are you saying that the spindle motor must be assigned as an AXIS as well as the spindle? I only have it mapped to the spindle.

Thanks.

- Steve