Messages

291

Mach4 General Discussion / Re: Is Mach4 really Hobby Material?

« on: January 22, 2018, 04:51:57 AM »

Newbie question save me some time.

Is Mach4 lathe threading currently 100% functional as described in the manual for the hobby version?

and

What external controllers currently provide 100% functionality for lathe threading at this time?

Thanks,
RICH

292

General Mach Discussion / Re: How to resume after G code is stopped safely - problem

« on: January 21, 2018, 08:01:12 PM »

zmajmr,
Mach 3  is the way it is, there will be no updates or changes, and as already been posted things work the way they work and not how you want or envision how something  should work.
 
Get over it and use what you now  know  and move forward.

RICH

293

Mach4 General Discussion / Re: Is Mach4 really Hobby Material?

« on: January 21, 2018, 09:44:56 AM »

Already posted about cost of upgrading to Mach 4 and thought it appropriate to post about TIME.

The first thing that comes to my mind is when and if one should upgrade at all.
Only the individual  can determine when, recall my undertaker comment, one will upgrade in
the future.

- If currently Mach 3 does everything you want it to do then no hurry
- If Mach 4 offers you something you need and desire that is lacking in Mach3 then maybe  start the transition.
- If you are a newbie to CNC, then chances are you don't know what you really need, the  learning time may be about the same, you
   won't be biased by something you don't  know about in the first place, Mach 4 may be the better choice.
 
Matters not if you are a hobbiest or commercial from a practical point of usage.


Some idea of time to convert was already posted and it is subjective. A few things come to mind as someone who only fooled with Mach 4 some three years ago. I'll keep track of of time when I start looking into Mach4 just out of curiuosity. But being a little wiser these days I will assume some things and accept some things as follows:

- Mach 4 hobby works for every command that is in the current manuals and accept the fact  that there are differences in the
  commands and they agree with books by Smid.

- The motion controller can provide for the instructions given it by Mach4 for every  command. Understand that I just don't have any
   tolerance to waite for "second party"  to  make their controller functional, said differentlt and candidly, have no tolerance for
   waiting years for some command to be implemented!

- Documentation must be available and complete for the above two comments relative to a basic mill or lathe. Currently there are 10 
  Mach 4 documents available for Mach of  which one probably needs to "study" 5 of them. Two are basicaly gcode programming
  and the time to transition should be relatively short for me. The gcode manuals  are not  meant to teach you how to write / program gcode and if  one deisres understanding surely     you will  find it in the Smid series of books. Smids CNC Handbook is 500 pages, so figure   around 30-40 hours to read it, then another 120 hours to study it, or take a two courses at a  tech  school for say 20 weeks! The TIME required to learn gcode is just a matter of degree of the level required to the what you need to do. And yes, if you don't use it you will loose it, but the refresh time certainly is shorter.

- I would say allow an hour for each for the Mach 4 manuals to get a "flavor" and can't really   say anything about an external  controller manual. If the status of completness is not there     then it could be a show stopper for me personaly at this time. Hmm ....the manual for Mach   3 mill took  6 months to do, and yes have done a few so I understand the investment of     time for a manual.
  BUT
 After all these years Mach 4  should have good manuals and there is NO reason not to!

- If you are more advanced and will desire screen customization additional  time frames     come into play. Any one who has done a
  custom screen, even a specific custom page using  VB in Mach 3, and knew how to use a screen designer, knows the effort required.
  I can only "assume" that the current screen designer is still rather intuitive and the transition won't take to much time. It will be just
  like learning a new CAM program since you need to  use the new tools that are provided.
  SO
  No use bitching about Lua ( I think it's still something they do in Hawaii ). 
  That's the tool necessary, and as Graig pointed out, one will need to understand Mach 4's structure.  Thus the user will need to invest
  time into knowing what they want to do, learn a new screen designer, study / learn the new structure, and lastly be able and willing
  to transition to a new programming language.  This is the one that reflect's back onto "Mach 3 doing what I want it to do". I
  personally will need to invest a fair amount of time just getting   Mach 4 Hobby to do replace what I can do in Mach 3.

I must say the following and mean no offense to anyone.
If one does not want to invest the TIME, good grief READ or STUDY, then please pursue a different hobby, since  a few parts of CNC are NOT  plug and play!


Just some thoughts about Mach 4, my other hobby is calling,

RICH  

294

General Mach Discussion / Re: Debounce

« on: January 18, 2018, 09:56:35 PM »

Bill,
Not that I am aware of or can recall from some post.
If there is something internal to Mach code, where it is used in some way, only Artsoft would know.
I know what I know from asking Art way back whenever on some specifics relating to testing we were doing.

RICH

295

Mach4 General Discussion / Re: Is Mach4 really Hobby Material?

« on: January 18, 2018, 09:12:45 PM »

Steve,

-.  -.--  ...-- .--.  ,  yep,  I certainly know about other hobby costs.  That's one of the things that all hobbies have, namely, cost.

Cost is just a matter of degree one wants to expend on his hobby and everybody is different. What is expensive to one person is peanuts  to another. The farmers barn is sided and roofed with Al but the house siding is in shambles.  I know folks who spend more on an accurate gun / sniper rifle than some pay for a car. Heck, some youngsters  spend more on one mag wheel for their junk car than  the cost to convert to Mach4. The neighbor bought a $3k planer for his wood working hobby and the bird houses he makes are not exactly flying off the shelves in his shop. All depends on what one wants and once you decide you have to pay for it.

COST- if your going to convert to Mach4  one will need a license, most likely an external motion device  and maybe a
          breakout board  .....so $500 to play in the new arena.
          If one does not want to spend $500 then don't upgrade to Mach 4. Period!
          Only the individual can rationalize it out.
  
I like to think of Mach4 similar to what an undertaker once told me ............... there is time and we are patient, but, sooner or later you all come to us, maybe not me, but the  services will be needed!

So much for COST.

RICH

 

296

General Mach Discussion / Re: Debounce

« on: January 18, 2018, 04:07:01 PM »

Relative to RPM readout and triggering to start  a thread path:

  Index debounce will affect the sensitivity of the index signal. IT basically is how many interrupt periods the signal must be present, or not present before a change is actually sensed in that line. SO if set to 2 for example, when the index appears it will be ignored for 2 periods to make sure it isnt noise. Same with when it disappears. Setting debounce too high will make the index go away altogether.

  Since the length of the index is dependent on spindle speed, minimum length is variable, but the time must be at least 1 period at a debounce of zero. SO in 25000, thats 40us.
  If a person notices a dropoff in RPM at a certain speed, they need usually a lower index debounce. Index inputs from an encoder are usually pretty short and will limit speed readings at some point as you go higher.

If you have the debounce setting too high the axis will just sit there waiting to confirm the rpm
before the start of a thread path.

Don't have specifics relative to switches .

RICH

297

Mach4 General Discussion / Re: Is Mach4 really Hobby Material?

« on: January 18, 2018, 03:28:07 PM »

Is Mach4 really Hobby Material?

The question is rather thought provoking. A hobby is something one does for personal  pleasure for whatever reasons and the reason need not make any sense to anybody except the one enjoying the hobby. The level pursued, time spent enjoying it, choice of activities associated with the hobby provides an arena to satsify the individual. So the answer is yes..... Mach 4 is hobby material and is just one part of CNC.

Personally can't get emotional about Mach 4 because of how I view it.

RICH

298

Mach4 General Discussion / Re: Is Mach4 really Hobby Material?

« on: January 18, 2018, 02:59:43 PM »

Graig,
Thanks for the time estimates since they give a "rough idea" on what a convert to Mach 4
may need to invest. My only comment, and only a guess, would be that a "newbie" may add another 100 hours.

RICH

299

Mach4 General Discussion / Re: Is Mach4 really Hobby Material?

« on: January 17, 2018, 09:01:59 PM »

Graig,
Can you provide a wild ask guess on long it may take a current Mach 3 user to:

- Transition from Mach3 mill and lathe to Mach 4 mill and lathe and be capable with both?
- Learn to create say a rather complex screen page?
- Be able to do the Lua coding / programing as compared to what was used for Mach 3?

Just some wild ask time frames,

RICH

300

Mach4 General Discussion / Re: Is Mach4 really Hobby Material?

« on: January 17, 2018, 08:42:31 PM »

Hmm....this may turn out to be a very interesting thread.

I am thinking that I'll just waite for Russ to figure Mach 4 all out and then can just call him to bring me up to speed in short order. 

RICH