Messages

1

General Mach Discussion / Re: Mach3 4th axis assistance Is Mach4 better for this?

« on: October 02, 2017, 10:07:09 PM »

SOLUTION IS FOUND.  The ebay 80mm and 100mm 4th axis wont work if you have too many steps.  I was set to 10 MS on my Geckodrives.  I changed after a lot of consideration and consternation to 5 MS on my 213V and it finally works!  I have tried 2 motors and spent countless ours trying to figure this out.  I knew I was missing steps at the lower speeds.  I have been trying to find a threshold where I could make it work.  However the only way to successfully run at lower speeds for steel was to change the drive to 5 micro-steps and voila it runs without missing or skipping a step.

2

General Mach Discussion / Re: Mach3 4th axis assistance Is Mach4 better for this?

« on: September 11, 2017, 01:37:26 PM »

One other thing, I carefully researched 4th axis on this blog, prior to starting this addition, the only surprise was that controller stopped working altogether after I eliminated the config tool path for 4th axis and used the z axis for the radius calculation.  Either the power requirements were too much for the system or the BOB.  All LED's showed normal but no motion.  Voltages appeared correct, don't have an oscilloscope.  When I tried the Smooth Stepper BOB (piggy back) still no motion.  I didn't try the C-11 on the KL stepper drivers, i wasn't willing to risk ruining it.  So I need to test the drivers independently although they are opti-isolated and probably should be fine, no LED errors.  Voltages appeared to be correct on the C-10 outputs as well.

This has been a real puzzle.  Could have been a power spike don't remember one, but I have everything on power strips.  I don't know other than one successful pass and then nothing worked over a period of two days, beginning with the x axis.  then the Y then  the A then the Z.

3

General Mach Discussion / Re: Mach3 4th axis assistance Is Mach4 better for this?

« on: September 11, 2017, 01:21:52 PM »

There's an option in Config Toolpath for 4th axis feedrate. Then, on the settings page, you need to enter the radius of your part. Then you should see proper feedrates.

See my post today which explains partially that I tried this first and got very unacceptably slow performance.  As others have posted in this topic it would take the better part of a day to do any machining as slow as it moves.  When I tried putting the radius information on the Z axis and made the feed rate 250 it worked normally, but only worked on one pass.  In order to reduce operations in the way you describe, I would have to make a single .135 inch cut per flute just to be done in a reasonable time.

4

General Mach Discussion / Re: Mach3 4th axis assistance Is Mach4 better for this?

« on: September 11, 2017, 01:14:55 PM »

Hello

If you notice the programming the radius information is given by Z axis position.  There seems to be two schools of thought:  1 is put the radius information in the Mach 3 screen as you and ger21 suggest and the other, which seems to me Hoss has said is raise the feed rate to 200-300 or more and suddenly you get much better feed rates.  I tried the latter and crashed my controller.  I don't whether the BOB which was probably suspect, I felt that for some time a C-10, or it was too much for the system.  I have a new C-11 board and gecko drivers and testing runs fine.  Will be finishing the new controller box today and should be up and running.  I can try both methods.  Next step is to buy a power cleaner of sufficient size, I believe the power sine wave has a lot of garbage in the sine wave, already use one a gem scale which eliminated the voltage fluctuations which played havoc on its accuracy.

I built a new controller box out of a tower so there is room for expansion and reduction of heat through 3 fans.  I  have heat-sinked the Gecko Drives and now every component is opti-isolated.  Separated the power supplies from the rest of the equipment and added a power switch for the 4th axis so the driver will not be powered unless it is in use.  I have isolated the ESS smooth stepper power with an external charger.

Still don't know if the KL-5056 and 8070 D steppers are harmed or not, if I can determine how to test them I may use on another project either running an old craftsman lathe 6 x 18 or a 4 axis router with much smaller stepper motors.  I am very sure that the cheap C-10 board is not functioning.  I have one rough running 570 oz NEMA 23 motor, which I replaced always keep a spare,, the cheap Chinese stepper motors do not seem to have great life spans.  I will buy better stepper motors in the future.  I have lost two of them in 8 months.  It may be either the stepper drivers or that C-10 as well. I have kept the drivers just under 5 amps for the 570 oz motors.

I have pretty heavy usage for a hobby machine, already wish I had a bigger mill (Taiwanese built) than the G-0704.  I have a lathe which has tremendous tolerances, which will never be a CNC. 

5

General Mach Discussion / Re: Mach3 4th axis assistance Is Mach4 better for this?

« on: August 28, 2017, 04:01:54 PM »

By the way that is a .003 cut on the z axis for 3/4" bar stock using the radius to calculated the cut.  Just in case you are wondering.

6

General Mach Discussion / Re: Mach3 4th axis assistance Is Mach4 better for this?

« on: August 28, 2017, 03:58:53 PM »

My 4th axis is 6:1 ratio.  running G0 runs normally.  Running G1 at 10.0 feed rate the rotation is very slow as in moving but barely perceptible.  a combination command at about 200 Feed rate will make the combination of axes run maybe around 5 feed rate which will cut a spiral on 3/4" aluminum rod.   if the 4th axis is not involved then runs normally.  Posts on this on similar threads sugggest to raise the Feed rate until it moves normally. That worked until I had a failure.  I hate to use less steps.  The vague instructions say to run 1 degree required pulse.

I think the high feed rate (250) that I have to run may have ruined my previous equipment that ran fine for 6-7 months.  I am pretty sure that the BOB was marginal to start with, but the stepper drivers without a oscilloscope or willingness to use my new BOB that works seem suspect as well.  The proof of the pudding would be to wire the stepper drivers to the new BOB and try them out.  The only new feature is the 4th axis.

My question is two fold, is there a better solution than increasing the feed rate?  And will Mach4 which is supposed to have better 3D graphics work any better with the 4th axis?  I really hate to artificially raise the feed rate to get better  movement I am not looking for a terribly fast feed rate but will need to cut around 3.0 in steel.  so 3/4" twisted flutes on steel at 45 degrees for a total of eight flutes, rotating 270 degree over 4 to 4.5 inches.

My question was on speed do I need to raise the speed to those really high numbers in the motor setup for the a axis rotation just to make the motor turn at a normal rate of speed? 

Not asking a lot the programming is easy and I am using the diameter (radius) after the cut for Mach3 to calculate the correct moves.  in other words

G1 F3.0 Z0.372
G1 F250.0 X4.5 A270.0

That is as simple as it gets.  I need a high feed rate to get reasonable movement on both axes.  Otherwise a simple x,y,z movement would be and is F3.0 to 5.0.

7

General Mach Discussion / Mach3 4th axis assistance Is Mach4 better for this?

« on: August 28, 2017, 10:20:10 AM »

Recently bought a 4th axis on ebay.  when running the 4th axis with X axis successfully made one pass then problems arose.  the Command F250 X4.5 A270.  Completed and stalled after one pass. Mach3 version .062. It appears my c-10 BOB decided that was the end from AutomationTechnologies.  Started with X axis stopping, then Y Axis finally the entire board.  Also using KL-5056D and KL-8070D.  Finally resolved with new BOB - C11G from another supplier.  And new Gecko 213V stepper drivers.  Not sure if the Keling Drivers are bad, think thye might be.  Also Y axis motor not as smooth as it used to be.  Even after adjusting trim posts , replacing that motor.

48V Keling supply Nema 23 570s and a Nema 34 906 rotory 3.5 Amp nema 23 57.

Work fine in testing yesterday with upgrades.  ran a short test run with simultaneous x and A axis moves.  Not sure what the A Axis settings should be at 10 MS .  Always ran 10 MS at 10160 at 20 (don't need much more will eventually settle at 40 fps) on velocity for x y and z.   Have Steps per degree at 33.333334
6 gear reduction  takes a very high velocity like 8000 and acceleration turn up to operate.  Is this about right?  Not comfortable having to set so high.

Thought it could be the stepper motor the Nema 23 57 which is a designation I don't understand.

Amperage's set up right on Stepper Drivers.

Windows 10 through an ESS SmoothStepper.  Everything is optically isolated now.  I did try the companion board for the smooth stepper and it did't work, but I think it could be the KL stepper drivers.

Will Mach4 Hobby drive the 4th axis better without the excessive Feed Rate?  Setting the Feed Rate at 200 to 250 seems like a bad approach and I wonder if that was part of the troubles.

Any assistance would be useful.  I bought a new controller box ( computer tower ) with more fans and real estate have been using the ultra tight fitting Automation Technologies box which I was never satisfied.  Heat sinks and all should be much better.

I will take a picture after I am done.  The testing went fine so it is put it together permanently.  Driving a G-0704 mill.  Still looking for a belt drive conversion for the mill.

Thanks for any assistance you can offer.

8

SmoothStepper USB / Smoothstepper ESS and CNC4PC seems to have no signals to stepper drivers

« on: August 19, 2017, 10:31:34 PM »

Try as I might seems like the signal strength isn't there.  plenty of 5 volt power and set only the 1st port to power also the second.  Could this be a stepper driver problem?  Ordered a BOB today, my old C-10 stopped after adding a 4th axis.  Thought it could be a resonance problem but more likely not.  Ordered gecko steppers to replace the Keling K5056-D and the K-8070-D.  Also thought it could be a recent recent windows 10 upgrade.  All lights are correct.  The ESS pings. 
Any thoughts?