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Messages - BobWarfield

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81
Ray, I'm not the first one to tell you this, and you aren't the first one to try.

But hey, I admire your spirit.  Show us how to make it work.

What I haven't heard is why the impact wrench is so poorly suited to an ATC, because it does solve all these problems and is a proven design.

Best,

BW

82
The Mach1 system reveals the secret here.  There are really two issues to consider.

First is locking the tool holder to the mill.  That's going to be a function of the surface area of the R8 taper and the pull force.  I am not too surprised that 600 lbs suffices for that force, even with quite a lot of "work" being done by the spindle. 

But there is a second force, and the way it works is hugely counterproductive to the first.  That second force is the squeeze on a collet to hold the tool.  It doesn't exist with solid tool holders, and it is the reason the Mach1 system has that special R8 collet holder.  It's purpose is not only to squeeze the collect down on the tool and not only to provide a reference datum so Z is repeatable.  It's alternate purpose is to provide a clean r8 taper surface on the tool.  You can see this clearly on the patent illustration:

http://www.google.com/patents?id=8mgWAAAAEBAJ&printsec=abstract&zoom=4

Why is this so important?  Because the deformation of the collet as it locks down on the tool really interferes with its ability to make good contact with the R8 taper.  If you think of bluing tapers, there is no way in heck that there is much precision in that interface.  So now the drawbar force must not only provide sufficient clamping, but it must also combat the reduced surface area and hence friction of the collet in the taper.  The Mach1 system avoids all of that.

Folks get started on these air-cylinder only systems because they seem simpler than an impact wrench system.  But they're really not unless you're prepared to live with a huge amount of drawbar tension, and even then I wonder how well they are going to work with a facemill or a large silver and deming bit.  People keep saying that this has been tried over and over, and it has.  The drawbar manufacturers would love a simpler cheaper mechanism, if only one would work.  Yet they keep shipping impact wrench based systems for R8, or special patented tricks like Mach1.

What I will tell you is that a rookie machinist can build an impact wrench system in an afternoon and it won't suffer from any of these problems.  It can be completely automated for use in an ATC if desired.  It's simpler and cheaper.  Your biggest challenge for the ATC is that you'll be using solid R8 holders which don't have a standard interface for the ATC carousel.  That's no big deal.  You'll need to fab some collars for the tooling that serves that purpose.  Meanwhile, you will be saving a fortune on TTS holders and you'll have a more rigid system to boot.

Cheers,

BW

83
Feature Requests / Asymmetrical Backlash Comp
« on: June 07, 2009, 01:51:43 PM »
Lots of VMC's allow 2 values for backlash on each axis: one for each direction.  Asymmetrical backlash is not that uncommon.  I have one axis that has 10x the backlash in one direction than the other, so I have no idea what I'd use for a value if trying to backlash compensate without being able to specify by direction.  The reasons for asymmetry are many, but in this case it is the Z-axis which has gravity in one direction and a very heavy head.

Since I understand backlash comp is slated to be moved out of the parallel driver and into the trajectory planner soon, that would be an ideal time to make this change.

Cheers,

BW

84
Feature Requests / Click to Jog
« on: June 07, 2009, 01:49:38 PM »
It would be cool if you could click the mouse on the toolpath display and jog to that location without changing the Z.

Lots of times I want to go to a "neighborhood" and then jog down in Z to get more precise.

Cheers,

BW

85
Feature Requests / Overhaul of Wizard Selection Menu
« on: May 10, 2009, 09:40:14 PM »
A couple of things would make this menu a lot nicer and more useful:

-  MRU list at top.  Often, one wants to go right back to the Wizard they were just using.  This is particularly painful on Wizards you have to scroll to get to (like Newfangled!).  It would be great to be able to see the last 3 Wizards accessed at the top of the menu so you could immediately pick one.

-  Let it size larger if the screen allows.  It requires a lot of scrolling by default.

I looked a little bit at trying to write a VB script to do this.  Doesn't look easy because I couldn't see a way to load the list of folders in the add-on directory so I could build a menu.

Cheers,

BW

86
Hello all.  Just got my system to spin a servo for the first time on my IH Mill project.  Full details are available on my web site here:

http://www.cnccookbook.com/CCMillCNCHome.html

It took me a little longer than I expected to debug the electronics well enough to spin a servo, and several things I discovered seemed arcane to me, so I thought I would post here the list of things I had to do to make it work in case that helps others.  I am using a Smoothstepper with CNC4PC breakout (plugs into Smoothstepper), CNC4PC Master Control Board, and Gecko G320 servo drivers.

Here is the list of things I had to change from my original test configuration to get things working:

1.  Set CNC4PC Master Control Board DIP switches for G320. It acts funny on the other board types whether or not Err/Res is connected.

2.  Discovered I had mislabeled the leads from my front panel for the "Start" and "E-stop", so they were connected backwards.

3.  Reverse the motor connections because they were backwards compared to what the encoder indicated, causing an immediate servo fault.

4.  In doing #3, I reversed the wrong leads and had to replace the power supply rectifier. I don't think I blew the Gecko, amazingly!

5.  Connect a 47K ohm resistor across pins 1 and 3 of the G320 to ensure the bridge initializes properly. This was buried in a hard to find Mariss note on CNCZone.  If you have power on fault problems with the G320, this helps a lot.  Mariss has said this change will go into next generation servo drives.

6.  Now I was getting the servo to hold position, so I played with the tuning trimpots a bit. I get a gentle buzz/rattle, but not really a "hum".  Holding force is really strong even with modest gain.  I could not fault the servo trying to turn shaft by hand.

7.  In Mach3, set Step/Dir to ActiveLo. Set pulse width to 5 (the pulse width may be ignored for Smoothstepper, but I was taking no chances!).

8.  Connect "Common" on G320 to +5V on breakout card instead of Ground. Another one that's easy to miss unless you read a lot of posts on various boards!  For me, "Common" meant ground, not +5V.  I discovered this when I noticed in the Geckodrive manual this one used to be labeled +5V.  Sure wish they'd kept that label!

9.  Set up the proper motor tuning parameters on Mach3. IH says 115 IPM speed and 0.15g of acceleration, according to another post I found. I also needed 28,240 steps to move 1".

10.  Set the Smoothstepper jumpers to actually provide +5V to the breakout board. Otherwise, the terminals marked "+5V" are 0V! This was a surprise.  The terminals marked +5V are not powered unless you set jumpers on the Smoothstepper.  Hence my work with "Common" initially had no effect.  Finally spotted the jumper when I was rereading all the docs for all the boards.

Now I can spin the servo this way and that with Mach3. It can still fault if I rapidly change directions at full jog, but that's just tuning and I need to set it properly on the actual machine instead of with servos flopping around on the floor.  It's pretty cool to be able to do this with a laptop too.

I must admit that per the discussion on my Cookbook Blog on the Eternal Servo vs Stepper Jihad, it was a lot harder to spin a servo than a stepper. In general, I encountered a lot of less than obvious things including the CNC4PC DIP switch settings, need for the 47K ohm resistor, and bizarre experiences with "Common", which has to be +5V, and which didn't get +5V until the Smoothstepper jumpers were enabled.

I hope these notes help the next guy who searches everywhere for "servo fault g320 problems" as I did! FWIW, I think I read every post on G320's on this board, on the Mach3 board (both Yahoo and Artsoft's), on CNCZone, and on the Geckodrive boards.  I learned a lot in the process, but not all of my answers were there, hence this post.

The Internet is your friend!

My next steps will be to clean up my breadboard wiring, wire up 2 more modules, test, stick it all into the enclosure box, test, mount servos on the machine, test, and make chips!

Cheers,

BW

87
Brett, as I say, I was able to find it.  I leave you to decide whether it ought to be easier to find. 

Best,

BW

88
Brett, I found the SDK searching the Mach Yahoo Board, just seemed like it ought to be something one could easily find off your menus at the top of these web pages.  I was not successful navigating to it there.

Best,

BW

89
Suggestions:

Seems like there ought to be a link to the SDK on the Downloads menu or perhaps on the PlugIns page for those that want to get it and participate in writing a plug in.

Also, it would be cool if the plug-ins page had source code where its available.  I know some plugins will have it and some won't.

Best,

BW

90
Feature Requests / Threading on the Lathe for GRex!
« on: December 04, 2006, 12:01:06 AM »
Because a lathe without threading isn't much of a lathe.

Best,

BW

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