Machsupport Forum
Mach Discussion => Mach4 General Discussion => Topic started by: svieau on June 07, 2021, 05:16:06 PM
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My pierce height in Mach4 is not right and don't know where to go to fix it. Loaded code from Sheetcam into Mach4 then starting to cycle start on a part. It will start the probe down to the metal on my table, it touches and then dose not go up to my 0.150 pierce height, it is at 0.00 on the metal. I'm doing this without my Hypertherm on just going through the g-codes before start. My g-code shows' X0.15 then M63P3 to fire torch, but stopping at 0.00 on the metal. I have gone through Sheetcam and Mach4 to make sure everything is set to the 0.15 pierce and 0.060 for cut. I am sure that I am missing something and I don't know where. Please Help
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Could I please ask for a start what motion controller you are using? I use the ESS and the TMC3in1 height control and have got that to work wonderfully.
This could be a lot of things but I will give you a few things to check.
When you probe your work piece can you see your probe activate? does the probe signal show as active on the diagnostic page? Could be that the probe is not contacting before the commanded probe travel has completed and it is just hanging waiting. Do you get any error messages? What does your history say - that might give you a clue.
If you are using an ESS make sure you have the latest software for it - there was a time a few versions ago where it would hang on any G04 pause commands but that has been fixed with the latest versions of Mach4 and the ESS software.
Maybe you could post your G Code for a simple job so we could look for any errors in that.
You will get it working - mine works perfectly and I am very happy with it.
Steve
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Thank You Wallerawang for answering me back. Answers to your questions are, Yes I can see the probe activated on my Mach4 page. I'm using Build260 and it has a probe light on the lower right hand corner that comes on when probing. I have a c-25BOB with ESS motion control board and a PriceCNC AVHC10 height controller. I'm also using a CNC4PC PTS-1 touch sensor that I can see the touch sensor light up when touching metal on my table. That is when it is suppose to go up to my pierce height but just stops at 0.00. My history ESS: successful probe0 strike probing finished, probe signal says0. When you say if I'm using the latest software for my ESS, I don't know what that means. I did pick Build260 for Mach4 because CNC4PC told me to use with the height controller and the latest while setting up my ESS, is that what you mean about software? This is a home built table that I did and wishing I had some one close to me to work out all the bugs that I have but just can't. I have been working out the bugs one at a time and getting closer to start burning. I want to get to know everything about all the programs and how they work before burning metal. I'm hoping that my g-codes show up, I think I did that right?
While working on your answers this morning I could not get my probe to work history show's that can't transition from probing to running. Had to restart Mach4 a couple of times to get it to work. What could that be? Hope you can help, Thank You.
Steve
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Well I guess that I don't know how to upload my g-code, sorry I will try later.
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Hi Firstly update Mach4 Hobby to version 4.2.0.4612 and ESS plugin to version 275 - I think this will make a big difference as it will fix the hang on G04 commands (Pause commands)
Steve
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Thanks Wallerawang, I will try that.
Steve
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I have it changed to 4.2.0.4612 and ESS to version 275. This is the problem I have now, no probing led light on, or when it touches it will not stops, continue down to torch breakaway. This is why I had build 260 in there because CNC4PC said that is the only their torch height control will work. At the time the THC was defected and didn't work. I checked and double checked all of my inputs and outputs were checked off and they are. I installed that one build hoping that would work with my THC now that I have my THC that was working. When put into cycle I had no enable LED on my THC or on my diagnostic page any probe LED on. When it contacted the plate on my table it didn't stop. What can I try now.
Steve
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Well that is going to be a problem - my pausing issues after probing went away after updating to the later versions of Mach 4 and the ESS plugin but I can see that is causing you another problem.
I really think you need to stay on the later versions of the software to get rid of your problem with the non stop pausing - I had to with mine. We can work through the other issues so you can.
Could you please draw a simple square and output the G Code for that and post the G Code here and I might be able to see if there is anything odd in that. You will have to save it as a text file and give it a unique name so it will save to here. (This is one thing to try and maybe I'll see something odd.)
With what I know of the Price THC it should work with any of the ESS plugins as it outputs up and down controls externally from it's control box and commands Mach to move by itself - (the Price control box commands the up and down moves).
How does your probe signal work? Do you use a limit type switch (floating head) or an ohmic detector - the probing is independent from the type of THC you use and we should be able to see why that isn't working. When you are on the diagnostic page can you simulate a probe strike by either tripping the probe switch manually if using a switch or by earthing out your torch head if you are using an ohmic system. Once we get a reliable probe detection we can move on from there. Can you check that the probe input is correct in your ESS set up and you can get the probe signal to light up on the diagnostic page when you simulate a probe strike. Check the wiring, the probe input is correct, the probe indicator light comes on when you simulate a probe strike. If that works as it should we should be able to move onto something else.
Do you use Mach 4's built in plasma screen? I need to know if we are working on the same screen.
Don't worry I'm sure we can get this to work - we just need to track down where the issue is.
Steve
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Thanks for your reply Wallerawang. Well I was out trying to trip my ohmic sensor and just can't get it to trip. I have 3 LED lights on my sensor- power, enable and touch. All my hookup is the same as before changing the build of Mach4. Now sending it to cycle start the enable light will not come on so it will not show the probe being tripped. It also dose not show on my diagnostic page. Let me try to work on it some more in the morning and get back to you. Thanks again for the response, I will get to you.
Steve
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Wallerawang I did make a 6X6 plate to a g-code and had trouble to get it to work. When cycle start at N0010 of the codes it only went to the next line N0020 and stops with no other movement. When I start it on line N0120 it will probe and touch then back up to my pierce height of 0.15. Then it would stop because I have my plasma cutter off just trying to get my THC to work. When I downloaded the latest build I couldn't get the probe or touch to work at all. So I went and changed my screen set to wxPlasma_Probe.set and got my probe and touch working. Did I just go back to the old screen set and not the new one? The screen looks totally different from the new one, the old one looks like the one that it was on before the download. With the new screen I couldn't get it to probe or touch, not even the diagnostic page showed any lights on when probing. I couldn't even get to simulate a strike with the new screen. Let me know if the attachment worked.
I am not using Mach4 plasma screen.
Hope this makes some kind of sense.
Steve
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It' very hard to diagnose problems over the forum but I'll try.
I am unfamiliar with the Price CNC plug in as well.
I opened your G Code Okay but some things look odd to me.
From your G Code:
Do you have a tool table set up? I see in your G code on line N0100 you have an M6 T1 - does the price cnc plug in set machine parameters via the tool table? - it would stop there waiting for you to hit the run button again to let Mach 4 know you have changed the tool.
Line N0060 - I can't see why you set the feed rate there when the next move not a g00 is the probing and it has a feed rate set on that line.
Again I'm not sure why you set a spindle speed on a plasma on line N0070.
N0110 I would have the Z height a lot higher than 0.080 to start the probing from - more like 2.0 in case your metal is a little warped.
N0140 and N0150 you just don't need -this is set on N0130?
N0160 and on makes sense to me.
Your G code is a little weird to me - but it could be things need by the Price plug in.
Can you try some things for me please?
1 With your machine is a safe position where it can not damage anything with a test fire of your torch - on the MDI can you issue a M62P3 - does that start the torch OK - Then issue a M63P3 to turn it off again straight away (a couple of seconds at most). Do you have a ARC OKAY signal and does it come on when the torch fires?
If you can't fire the torch and you don't get a ARC OKAY signal it would wait for that as well.
I guess you need to use the screen and plugins that work for you - the later ones should be better - I don't understand why your signals are not being recognised on the later versions.
We will just have to go through step by step to sort it out.
We need to confirm that the probe signal works and the torch fires Okay (using M62P3) you get an ARC OKAY signal as it fires and then you can turn the torch off with (M63P3) after that we will look further.
Try those couple of things and let me know how you go - we will get you going - it just might need a few tries of different things so we can eliminate possible troubles.
Steve
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Oh and the G04 P200.00 on line N0180 is a 200 second pause - when you have a decimal point in it it's in seconds, take the decimal point out and set it for P200 (no decimal point and it is in milli seconds)- that's more what you need.
Steve
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Thanks for the quick reply. I don't know that much about the g-codes but all I did is made up the 6x6 plate in Sheetcam and loaded into Mach4. I have the parameters set up for the size of material cut its only suppose to be T1 for the 10GA steel to be cut. I don't know what M6 is for but other then that Sheetcam is picking up all the rest of the numbers. The M62/M63 works fine as it did before, What was happening it would make its first cut then move to the second cut and the pierce height was getting higher and higher. and sometimes it would be dragging the plate on the table, my torch was not at cutting height.
I just wish I had someone like you close to help me with this table, I tried, even wrote a add in Craigslist with no answers.
Steve
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It sure would be easy if I was there - I live in the Blue Mountains west of Sydney in Australia so that won't be happening.
It might just be dodgy G code - the post processor in sheet cam might need editing.
So M62 and M63 work as they should - good that's one thing not to worry about.
If you are game you could try a few edits of the g code you posted - I don't know your machine so you will need to have your hand over the E Stop if you want to try this.
From the G code you posted here try these edits:
Take out lines N0060, N0070, N0100, N0130 and N0140. They are things I'm not sure you need in there.
Edit line N0180 to "G04 P200" - no decimal point or places.
I would like to know if this makes it at least probes and starts to cut. If the height wanders we will work on that next.
If that probes and starts to cut OK we will edit your post processor to give you good g code.
Steve
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And I live in the Cascades Mt range next to Mt. Rainer of Washington. I change all the g-code for that 6x6 plate, I still have at cycle start it will only go to the second line and stop. So I moved it to line #No120 hit cycle start, it will start to probe retract to pierce height of 0.15 move to M62P3 where the torch is to lite and doesn't lite. It stops at line N0190. I am going to go to Sheetcam and make sure that my torch on/off is there. Thanks again for the help.
Steve
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Wallerawang another thing is when I went back into Sheetcam and M62/M63 is there so I made another practice plate uploaded it to Mach4. What came up was M03/M04 to fire torch. I even went back into post processor of Sheetcam and it had M62/M63 to fire torch. I did try the M03 to fire it but nothing. I did have the torch working on M62/M63 so I don't know what to do now. Looking at Sheetcam post processor I am using Plasma PriceCNC AVHC10 THC zFloat with Pierce delay-G31. It is designed use with Mach3 and PriceCNC AVHC10
Steve
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Can I ask if you can find a Post Processor to suit Mach 4 - one for Mach 3 isn't going to work for you and me be the cause of some of your troubles.
The Sheetcam forums might have one or they might be able to suggest a close one.
Steve
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That is my biggest problems is trying to find anything for Mach4. I bought Mach4 program because they said that they were going to eliminate Mach3. Well you can't find anything about Mach4 on You Tube its all for Mach3. The closes thing that I found on the post processor was the one that I have loaded. I can't fine anyone that would tell me or otherwise one that would work.
Steve
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Okay - Send me the post processor you are using now and I will see if I can edit it to work a bit better - no promises but I have modified my own a few times.
Steve
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I am going to go through all of the post and see if I can find one that will work for me, if not I will get back with you. Thanks for all the help.
Steve
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I even went to the Sheetcam and asked which post to us for Mach4 and PriceCNC AVHC10. I haven't got any answer back yet, I will keep in touch.
Steve
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Maybe one for the Proma? THC might work - they are similar to the Price THC.
Steve
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This is close, some how it will not load a G31 code for probe. The file name is Mach4_Plasma (Edited). I don't know how to load this file, its a TNG and I think that's why it will not load. I don't know how to change it.
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Can't help with that one, sorry. TNG files are not something I use.
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I think that this other one is better to use, Plasma PriceCNC AVHC10 THC zFloat 2 Les with pierce delay-G31 Rob (edited). Do you have Sheetcam to look at the post on it or not. I don't know how to change the format so that I can upload it to the forum.
Thanks for your help, Steve
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Hi Steve
I'm not a Plasmaspider contributor so I can't down the file. But I did find the forum post that talks about how to get it going and there is some good clues in there. https://www.plasmaspider.com/viewtopic.php?f=58&p=197265
It is worth trying that post yourself - I could try and run the post but I can't test it on my machine as we have different torch height control systems. But lets put that off for a bit.
But before we worry about getting the post processor correct I need to step back to the start with this and confirm the following things are working:
Probing - In the MDI can you command a probe and dose it work? Yes or No?
Turning the torch off and on. in the MDI can you command the torch on and off? Yes or No?
ARC okay signal working. When the torch is firing do you get an Arc OK signal in Mach 4? Yes or No?
Can you start by confirming all these functions are working and the signals are being seen by Mach 4.
After that we need to the Torch Voltage is being read okay into the Price unit OK. - if that is good we need to get the Price control box set up correctly to suit different materials.
Can I ask what plasma source you are using? The manual for your plasma cutter will give you the required cutting voltages for each material. In the Price control box you set different cut voltages for each material.
Once the Price box is set for the correct voltage it will output up and down signals into Mach 4 to control the torch height. The Price box can simulate up and down moves to Mach 4. Can you do this simulation and is Mach 4 receiving these signals?
If you can confirm if all the above functions work OK then I can be sure if it is a problem with your machine or the post processor.
I'm sorry this is hard to do from a long way away and I just need to know what is happening. Don't worry we will get it going.
Steve
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I just went through your questions, to start probing works. My torch on/off doesn't work, I checked wires and program they are ok. That is all I can test until I get my torch to fire off. I do have a relay to my plasma and that is still hooked up and wiring correct. I have a brand new Hypertherm powermax 85 and I am using all the parameters of voltages and speed of cut that is in the book.
Steve
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Excellent plasma cutter - you won't have any issues with that.
Good news that your probing works.
Once you have all the functions working how they should we can go further - the torch not firing and no arc OK signal can cause the pauses you were speaking of.
Steve
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I have been working on this table all day. This is what I come up with, probe works and touch it will retract up to pierce height. Then where the torch is suppose to fire it won't. All of my wiring is the same and not changed until I changed the Mach4 program to the latest. Today I found out that the wire to my relay had no connection point on my BOB don't know why. I hooked it up to an out pin and tried it with no luck. What happen is when it went pass torch on the g-codes it would start the pattern as it thought torch was on and arc ok. I had a lot of trouble trying to get the right post into sheetcam it wanted to go back to M03 to turn torch and not M62/M63.I put that wire from relay to a post as I think that's what to do with it. I did try M03 it didn't turn it on. I am lost, sorry.
Steve
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Hi Steve
Yes it can be very frustrating but just take one step at a time.
You don't want to use M03 or M05 to control your torch - they are not co-ordinated with your torch movements. Use M62 and M63 as your torch needs to start and stop at precise points times during movement - this is one of the differences between Mach 3 and Mach 4.
Re the wire from your Torch Relay to the Breakout Board - the Pin you have connected it to needs to be set in your outputs in the ESS plug so Mach knows what to do when you command a M62 or M63.
I wish I was around the corner from you - all this would only take an hour or so to sort out if I could see what was happening directly.
Steve
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Boy do I wish you were here, spent the whole morning try to get my torch to fire off. Come to find out that my pin number was wrong, I didn't change the number when I changed the pin. Now that I get my torch to fire off, another problem. Torch fires off then turns off, history: ESS: Arc Okay(THC On) Went Out!!! Activating Feed Hold Now. I going to make a short MCI in a straight line and see if it will move, I will let you know. I really appreciate all of your help, Thank You
Steve
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Hi Steve
Some progress - that's good, the torch won't continue to fire unless it's cutting metal don't worry about that. Now you have to torch relay working and if you have the stop after probing again try moving to the versions of Mach 4 and ESS plug in that I spoke of before.
Steve
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I haven't done anything today, been busy. Let me ask you a question do you think it is better to change my THC to the one that you have or try to stick this one out. With all the problems that I am having it might be easier. I will try to play around with it tomorrow, it has to be ARC OK, thats what I think is stopping the movement. Thanks again.
Steve
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Steve
I can highly recommend the TMC3in1 THC. It works great. The secret with THC is when not to use it such as crossing cut lines, the start and finish of cuts and when accelerating and slowing down from corners and the TMC3in1 handles all that with cut rules and the setup in the plugin. If you can get one of them it plugs directly into the ESS and communicates at high speed with the ESS. I can help a lot with the post processor for that as well.
Steve
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Hello,
If you're having trouble with the "arc ok" go to Configure > Plasma screen configuration > Then use a register for your arc ok signal.
Make a static register and use that if you need to.
This will let you test to see if it's the arc ok signal that's the issue.
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Thanks GOOMBA, I did try it with no luck. It sounds like it would be arc ok. All it dose is probe then starts torch then stops and not move. Wallerawang I ordered the TMC 3in1 board from CNC4PC and just waiting for it then I will have to rewire it. I will be needing your help when all back together. Thanks again for all your help.
Steve
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I will be happy to when it gets there.
Steve
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While you are waiting - you could watch these - some very good info here although some of it won't make sense until you start cutting .
https://arclightcnc.com/sheetcam-tutorials/
Steve
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Wallerawang I am still waiting for THC3in1 control, they are saying that they are waiting for the new model. Coming out soon, I hope.
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No worries - that might be the "Warp Runner" I have heard about. It has the same height control functions as the the TMC3in1 with some extra leds for diagnosing faults.
Steve