Machsupport Forum
Mach Discussion => Mach4 General Discussion => Topic started by: Bill_O on March 06, 2019, 08:09:06 AM
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We make some machines that we need to change to using Mach4 running in the background from a program made using Visual Studio.
Currently we use a high end controller board with a custom program.
The manufacturer of the board on very little notice has informed us they will stop making the board on April 1st.
We are looking for anyone that knows Lua programing in Mach4 very well.
A knowledge of how Mach4 can be made to run in the background of another program is a huge plus.
This would need to be done at our facility in Plano, Texas.
We will pay for your time and travel expenses.
This is a time crunch for us so if at all possible we would like to get the help by the end of next week.
Please contact Bill at 1-800-310-2887
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Hi,
what controller? Is it a motion controller?
Mach4, very much like Mach3, is an application that runs in the foreground. There would be a plugin
that translates Machs instructions into whatever format the controller required to enact them.
I'm not sure that you could 'run Mach4 in the background'. What you need is a plugin for your controller
to talk to Mach4. It would (probably) be possible for Mach to instruct your controller to execute certain functions including
programmed routines. That is to say that Mach would be supervisor but your existing controller would retain its motion control
status.
Craig
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Craig,
The current motion controller we use is from a company called Delta Tau. We use their PMAC.
Our custom software currently works with the PMAC.
The problem is the PMAC is going to not be made any more.
I currently use Mach3 with an ESS and PMDX-126 for the cnc routers we sell.
That will also need to be changed to Mach4 down the line.
Hopefully at that point I have a better idea of how to do the Lua.
I have a lot of custom stuff for the routers.
What my problem is the bending machines we make.
We have a custom program that does certain things that we still need to be able to do.
Some of it I am almost sure can not be done in Mach4
So we want to change our current software to run Mach4 but just in the background to actually control the machine.
If you are curious about what the machines we make are here is out website.
www.computerizedcutters.com
Bill
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Very cool machine!
So you're looking for Mach4 to move the metal through the machine, bend the material, and notch the material?
From what I can tell, you would have Mach4 do the following:
Move ### Units (inches/mm) --> Notch1 --> Move ### --> Bend1 XDegrees --> Move ### --> Notch2... Move ### --> Notch1 --> Move### Bend2 --> etc..
Series of Notching and bending whether it be Notcher 1, 2, 3, etc... Bend Position 1, 2, 3, etc so many degrees.
What are you thinking as far as getting the information to Mach4 to move?
Do you have separate software that generates notched positions and bend positions?
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I don't see any reason Mach4 can't do it. It will take a bit of work which == time but certainly doable unless I'm missing something.
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Brett, that's what I'm thinking. That's why I was asking how they fet their information. The g code. Shouldn't be too bad, it's an awesome setup. Mach is for sure cable od doing the job, it's just a matter of telling Mach how to do it.
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Yup, it's just I/O and motion.
1) Figure out what needs to happen.
2) Figure out how the user interacts with.
3) Marry those 2 things.
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Hi,
kool machine.
The single most important feature of Mach4 is its programmatic flexibility. Indeed I believe that is the key
attribute that NFS required of Mach4 because it permits/promotes sales amongst OEMs.
If you want to pay I would happily work on such a project. As I live in New Zealand that idea might not float!
Additionally I suspect your time scale is overly ambitious. A bullet proof software solution is not likely to
result from lightning development.
Craig
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Thanks all for the responses.
Chad, you are correct in the order.
It does different things as the metal moves through the machine.
All of it is stuff that Mach can do except for some selecting of what to run and where to start which is all stuff out current custom software does.
We have modified out current software to output a gcode to be able to use Mach instead of out current controller board.
Here is a sample;
M54
G1 F 200.0 X22.81
M54
;Arc End Notch
G1 F 200.0 X22.93
M54
G1 F 200.0 X23.48
M54
G1 F 200.0 X24.00
M54
G1 F 200.0 X24.03
M54
G1 F 200.0 X24.58
M54
;Arc End Notch
G1 F 200.0 X24.76
M54
;Start Bending
G1 F200.0 X25.24
M57
G1 F3000.0 Y2.44
G1 F3000.0 Y-20
G1 F 200.0 X25.31
M54
G1 F200.0 X25.34
G1 F3000.0 Y24.49
G1 F3000.0 Y-10
G1 F200.0 X25.44
G1 F3000.0 Y28.67
G1 F3000.0 Y-10
G1 F 200.0 X25.50
M56
G1 F200.0 X25.54
G1 F3000.0 Y28.67
G1 F3000.0 Y-10
Actually very simple stuff.
My biggest problem is getting an encoder input for the material positioning.
We have an encoder with a wheel that rolls on the material.
Then if the feed roller slips we actually get the positioning from the encoder.
I think I might be getting a very very small handle on how to do the macros.
Craig.
Yes it is probably a little ambitious as far as time goes but I am just repeating what my boss wanted.
We have an opportunity to make a final purchase of out current controller board but want to know we are going to be able to work using Mach.
I wish you lived closer because we would absolutely pay for the development help.
Bill
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The only issue I see with this would be the encoder keeping track of your position. I don't have any experience with that, the only thing I can think of that would be close is the Vital Systems Encoder Feedback. They can get the encoder counts to have a closed loop system. I wonder if that would work, may take a little work to get it calibrated correctly though.
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Chad,
What I was thinking to do was do move then use and m code to check where the encoder says the position is, writing over the position dro and doing the move again. None of the errors in positioning should be very great on 1 small move but the accumulated error over the full length could be great.
Bill
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As you are thinking about incorporating Mach in your product you could become a license re-seller and should contact NFS directly for that reason. Since you may be responsible be for selling Mach4 in some quantity it would be in NFS's best interest to assist you in your search for programming assistance.
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Bill, That's true. I didn't figure the error would be very much if there was any. That's why I suggested the closed loop system.
But it shouldn't be very difficult to run an error check macro after each move. If expected position is not correct, adjust position. If it is incorrect, then it will need to know to finish the move. Issues arise, but they can be overcome. I would still look into the HiCON Integra. It may be a much more efficient way to be sure it is in the correct position.
MN300, not a bad idea.
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It seems like to me that the most difficult part of this deal would be programming the decision making part of the channel letters into mach 4. Going from "I want the letter F in this font and size" over to Gcode is likely where all their custom programming is. Mach 4 can easily handle the motion control and I/O (probably even the encoder error checking), but writing scripts to interpret a simple customer facing graphic interface where the letter, font, size, and quantity can be input would be a tremendous task.
If there is already other software doing this, then it seems like Mach 4 would be a perfectly capable candidate. If not, Mach 4 likely still has more than enough capability, but it will not be an overnight conversion and would require someone with intimate knowledge of LUA to program it.
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Your customers will expect a product that will be supported for years to come. This means selecting a hardware platform that will be available for the life of the equipment and software that can be maintained by your service organization.
Once you have the software customized you probably shouldn't upgrade the Mach version unless it adds something to your product. Multiple versions in the field could be a problem.
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From memory Delta Tau was taken over by Omron.
I am surprised they have left you stranded.
Have you talked to Omron directly?
Regards
John
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Sounds like a job for an automation specialist and a PLC on some of the machines. Omron makes a good product.