Machsupport Forum
Mach Discussion => General Mach Discussion => Topic started by: wmgeorge on December 20, 2017, 05:39:57 PM
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I am new here but not to CNC, have owned and operated several machines and refurbed a Milling machine.
Question I have a Chinese router 6040 and its pretty darn nicely built and it worked out of the box. Right now Mach3 Mill with some changes to the setup file and I ran about an hour long gcode out of VCarve with lots of movements and Z activity. Its running on a parallel port but I am getting only about 14,000 / 15,0000 pulse rate. Windows XP 32 bit with ALL the power saving, updating, wireless and the like turned off. Gcode file ran without issues, Homing and the like flawless.
Ok would I gain anything by installing a UC100? More pulses equal better??? Or should I just count my blessings and get on with it.
Oh windows Task Manager never shows over 30% CPU usage even when I Over Ride the Feed Rate to 200%
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Hi,
the number of pulses is those that are required to move an axis a given distance. If you used a UC100 it will produce
exactly the same number of pulses to go the same distance. In short if your parallel port is working then you will
notice NO difference to a UC100.
Where external motion controllers come into their own is if the PC has other software running, the UC100 is much
less susecptable to stalling or stuttering and can also be run on a much much wider range of PCs including 64 bit which can't
be done with a parallel port.
External motion controllers are able to produce very stable accurately timed pulse streams which stepper motors like, they
seem to run smoother and cooler even if not a great deal faster.
Craig
If you can do what you need with a parallel port then carry on. If you want to run a little smoother or use a late model
PC and OS then get an external controller. The UC100 is good but has only 'one ports worth' of IO, have a look at the
UC300 from the same company , its got 5 ports worth....inputs and outputs for Africa!
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Thanks Joe for the reply, I just added a bit to the OEM post about Task Manager only showing 30% CPU usage even when I bumped the Feed Rate up to 200%. The Tool Database in VCarve has the same feeds and speeds that I used on my Servo driven router machine a few years back.
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Hi,
Mach is not a hugely CPU thirsty program. What Mach requires is CONTINUOUS CPU service, if the CPU for whatever
reason stops to do something else then Mach will stall and usually stop.
External motion controllers are better for maintaining continuous service than a parallel port.
If you have a servo with a 10,000 count encoder, the current entry level incremental encoder, and you want the servo to
do 50 revs/sec max, that is 3000 rpm, then Mach would have to issue 50 x 10,000=500k pulses per second.
Machs parallel port is commonly capable of 25k and if you push it might get some PCs to produce 100k, not particularly
reliably but still 100k. This is still FIVE times short of whats required to drive a decent servo at max speed and max resolution.
Some external motion controllers can manage that speed but would absolutely require differential signalling. Be careful for
what you wish for....more pulses can also mean more headaches.
Craig
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Well for now I will just use the Parallel port as its working and I have proved that. I see the improved motion controllers on the market but most seem to be almost there, but I still see issues. Actually Mach3 has a lot of features, and since its been in use for a long time much support as here and other sites. Thanks again Craig for taking the time to reply.
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Its running on a parallel port but I am getting only about 14,000 / 15,0000 pulse rate.
Run Drivertest.exe in the Mach3 folder, and see what the pulse rate is there. If the Kernel speed is set to 25Khz, then it should be very close to 25,000.
If it's only 15,000, then I wouldn't use the parallel port, as you're PC is not running Mach3 correctly. One thing you can try is to make sure the PC is in Standard mode, and not ACPI mode.
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Its running on a parallel port but I am getting only about 14,000 / 15,0000 pulse rate.
Run Drivertest.exe in the Mach3 folder, and see what the pulse rate is there. If the Kernel speed is set to 25Khz, then it should be very close to 25,000.
If it's only 15,000, then I wouldn't use the parallel port, as you're PC is not running Mach3 correctly. One thing you can try is to make sure the PC is in Standard mode, and not ACPI mode.
Did that before I even started. Very solid test results. This is a CNC router it can only run so fast before you either start burning wood or bits up. High speed not really needed, must be reliable. Yes I need to switch over to the Standard mode.
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No, you don't understand. If you are seeing a pulse speed of 15,000, then Mach3 is only running at half speed. It is not working correctly, and I seriously doubt that it will be reliable.
In Config > Ports and Pins, do you have Sherline 1/2 Pulse Mode checked?
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No, you don't understand. If you are seeing a pulse speed of 15,000, then Mach3 is only running at half speed. It is not working correctly, and I seriously doubt that it will be reliable.
In Config > Ports and Pins, do you have Sherline 1/2 Pulse Mode checked?
So would going to the UC100 be a quick easy fix and solve the pulse rate issues, since I now have all my settings working and tested?
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Yes, but you may need to make changes to some or many of your settings.
And I'd recommend a UC400ETH over a UC100. It's about $25 more, but is newer, has more features, and has better noise immunity.
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Yes, but you may need to make changes to some or many of your settings.
And I'd recommend a UC400ETH over a UC100. It's about $25 more, but is newer, has more features, and has better noise immunity.
Well the 400 seems like a lot of extra wiring and work for a benefit I do not need. Plus by the time you factor in you need to purchase the needed cable its more like $50 more. I will change computer over to Standard, if no improvement then I will go with the UC100.
It looks like disabling ACPI also screws up the plug and play or device discovery, I would think that would cause more problems.
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It looks like disabling ACPI also screws up the plug and play or device discovery, I would think that would cause more problems.
In most cases, ACPI prevents Mach3 from running properly, and changing to Standard will usually fix this. Both PC's I have will not run Mach3 in ACPI mode, but work fine in Standard mode.
Well the 400 seems like a lot of extra wiring and work for a benefit I do not need.
The UC400ETH require no more wiring than a UC100. It just requires a ribbon cable to the G540 instead of a parallel cable. About $5. And an ethernet cable instead of USB. $2.
Ethernet provides a more reliable connection, and is more immune to noise issues.
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It looks like disabling ACPI also screws up the plug and play or device discovery, I would think that would cause more problems.
In most cases, ACPI prevents Mach3 from running properly, and changing to Standard will usually fix this. Both PC's I have will not run Mach3 in ACPI mode, but work fine in Standard mode.
Well the 400 seems like a lot of extra wiring and work for a benefit I do not need.
The UC400ETH require no more wiring than a UC100. It just requires a ribbon cable to the G540 instead of a parallel cable. About $5. And an ethernet cable instead of USB. $2.
Ethernet provides a more reliable connection, and is more immune to noise issues.
Mach3 runs just fine on my Lenovo laptop with ACPI and I ran an hour long very intensive VCarve gcode file without any issues what so ever. I even bumped the feed rate up 200% and the computer CPU was only using 30%. The 400 would require mounting inside the power/controller box and adding a power source which I could do. I will switch over to Standard to see if changes things.
So does Mach3 set the pulse frequency as needed?
Did I mention that I am / was a master electrician and specialized in HVAC/R controls. Also have been working with and building computers as a hobby since about 1980, and also a licensed ham back when you had to know something to get your call sign.
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So does Mach3 set the pulse frequency as needed?
No, you set the Kernel Frequency in Config > Ports and Pins.
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Well I went into the Bio's and disabled the CPU and USB ACPI modes and I am up to a little over 20,000 and very stable. I am trying to keep this simple and running on my spare computer
I also have two laser engravers to keep running, one a co2 40 watt and the other a Galvo fiber 20 watt machine for metals. Both those are on a Windows 7 Pro laptop and USB.
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Hi,
sounds like your dead set on a UC100 irrespective of what others say. In which case don't get a Chinese knock-off, they abound on EBay.
Buy direct from CNCDrive or their nominated distributor.
Craig
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Hi,
sounds like your dead set on a UC100 irrespective of what others say. In which case don't get a Chinese knock-off, they abound on EBay.
Buy direct from CNCDrive or their nominated distributor.
Craig
Actually I am also considering the UC400ETH just doing the research right now. Not finding a whole lot of people using it vs the UC100. Also finding out that Amazon is a guilty as eBay as having venders selling knock offs. Found that out on Arduino boards.
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So it looks like with the UC400ETH I need a CAT 5e crossover cable to connect directly to my PC can someone confirm that so I can get all the stuff in one shipment. Plus the parallel ribbon cable connector
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Well the UC400ETH is on order, thanks guys.
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whether or not you need a crossover cable depends on the ethernet adapter in you PC. Modern adapters don;t need a crossover cable, as they auto detect and do the switching internally. I don't use a crossover on either of my PC's.
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whether or not you need a crossover cable depends on the ethernet adapter in you PC. Modern adapters don;t need a crossover cable, as they auto detect and do the switching internally. I don't use a crossover on either of my PC's.
Well I have the whole works on order I went with what info was given in the UC400 docs. Cover is off the controller / PS box and voltage source located. I am assuming since its pin for pin compatible with the parallel port all my present settings will work. Zero documentation on configuring with Mach3/4 just about their own controller program. So are you using 3 or 4 with your setup? What pulse frequency?
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Hi,
with an external motion controller you don't set the frequency.
You set the 'Steps Per', 'Velocity' and 'Acceleration' and the plugin takes care of the rest. Unless you have a really high precision (count) encoder running at high spoeed
the external controller will put out pulse no troubles.
Craig
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You just install the plugin, set it as your motion device, and set the ports and pins. There's nothing else that's any different from using the parallel port, once you setup your network to see it, as described in the manual.
I have a UC300ETH, and have run it with Mach3, and UCCNC. I have the kernel speed at 200Khz, because I'm running servos with high encoder counts.
The Kernel speed is set in the plugin control window.
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So the settings I have now will work as is? Does Mach3 know about the controller or is it a Plug In that is loaded on start up?
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I can't say for sure. First thing you do is setup the network so the UC400 is recognized.
Then install the Mach3 plugin.
Then start Mach3.
If the UC400 is not detected, then you may need to go to Function Cfg > Reset Device Sel and restart Mach3. Then you can select the UC400 as your device.
You'll probably need to redo your motor tuning settings, due to the different kernel speed.
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Ok I got it. Motor tuning I can undefstand, just as long as the basic ports and pins are the same, and they should be if its a clone of a parallel port pin for pin. Thanks for the help.