Machsupport Forum

Mach Discussion => General Mach Discussion => Topic started by: ScotY on September 18, 2017, 10:11:32 PM

Title: Moving settings to another computer
Post by: ScotY on September 18, 2017, 10:11:32 PM
I'm sorry as I'm sure this has been asked before but my searching skills are very poor.  I have Mach3 (demo mode, running the lathe program only at this time) set up and operational on a Windows 10 laptop and I want to see if an old Windows 7 netbook will run it.  I found a thread that says to copy the XML file from the old to the new computer.  I've done that but when I start Mach3, it's showing the default settings.  I am certain I'm doing something wrong...obviously. ;D  Can anyone help?

Title: Re: Moving settings to another computer
Post by: ScotY on September 19, 2017, 12:23:24 AM
I'm also having problems with the Mach screen.  Even if I maximize the window, I cannot see the bottom portion of the screen.  I've changed display settings/resolution and it doesn't help.  My choices are limited to 1024x600 and 800x600 and neither one works.   Also, see the File menu in the upper right. There's a selection called "Entib."  What the heck is that???  When I click it, it brings up a Windows Media Player setup page.  ::)
Title: Re: Moving settings to another computer
Post by: ScotY on September 19, 2017, 12:53:24 AM
I have uninstalled Mach3, deleted the Mach3 folder from the hard drive (because it was still there), and resintalled Mach3...nothing has changed, still can't see the entire screen and "Entib" still remains in the file menu.  I've changed all the display settings and checked for updated drivers...nothing seems to be working. 

I then installed Mach4.  I can almost see the entire screen but some windows look compressed so it's not usable.  I'm really not sure what the problem is.  I've seen videos of Mach running on tablets (I think) and since Mach3 is an older program, I don't see why it's not working on this old netbook.  It seems to start up okay.

Anyone???

Thanks, Scot
Title: Re: Moving settings to another computer
Post by: Tweakie.CNC on September 19, 2017, 01:20:56 AM
Hi Scot,

Which external motion controller are you using ?

Did you copy your license file from the old to new computer installation ?

Tweakie.
Title: Re: Moving settings to another computer
Post by: ScotY on September 19, 2017, 02:04:55 AM
Hi Tweakie,

I'm using an ESS and just the demo versions of the software. I'm trying to decide which version to go with...not sure what I should do.
Title: Re: Moving settings to another computer
Post by: Tweakie.CNC on September 19, 2017, 02:26:04 AM
Hi Scot,

Rich is the expert lathe man and I am sure he will be along later (different time zone) to advise on the Mach3 / Mach4 choice.

Regarding the Mach3 screen; if you select Auto Enlarge in General Config. then drag the bottom right of the screen bounding box when Mach is closed and re-opened it should be the new size and show all the features.

Tweakie.
Title: Re: Moving settings to another computer
Post by: ScotY on September 19, 2017, 03:36:19 AM
Awesome, Tweakie, that worked!  Thank you!  I can't seem to find the equivalent function in Mach4 though.

Also, would you happen to know how I can transfer my Mach3 setup from computer to the next?  Can you do this in demo mode?  And is the process the same for Mach3 and 4?

Btw, my decision for Mach3 vs Mach4 is for both lathe and mill. I started using the Mach3 demo on the lathe only because I built the lathe first (still buying parts for the mill at the moment). The mill (I think) will be used more often so I'd consider it the primary machine.
Title: Re: Moving settings to another computer
Post by: Tweakie.CNC on September 19, 2017, 04:17:17 AM
Hi Scot,

To put Mach3 on another computer - Install Mach3 on the new computer then copy across your <profile> .xml file (plus any special screen sets or Macros if you have created any and also your ESS settings). This way you can preserve any set-up you have made.
The process is slightly different for Mach4.

If you are starting out from scratch then, I think, Mach4 would be the way to go.

For others, like me, we will cling onto Mach3 until such time as Mach4 (and the motion controllers software) are all fully matured.  ;D

Tweakie.
Title: Re: Moving settings to another computer
Post by: joeaverage on September 21, 2017, 05:09:59 AM
Hi ScotY,
I changed to Mach4 about a year ago. I don't have a lathe but my mill works very well with an ESS.

Mach4 milling/routing control software is complete and ready to rock. Backlash comp is the only feature that is missing from the ESS plugin
which would have any relevance to lathe or mill ops.

Mach4 uses LUA as scripting language and while LUA itself is pretty simple when you combine it with Machs API, wxWidgets and the likes it
can be quite a learning curve. Once you do its very good and easily out does Mach3 for ability to be customised.

This post probably won't help you decide....some will recommend Mach3 and with good cause, and others like me will recommend Mach4 also with
reasons. I think your choice will depend on what you want from this hobby...if you want to design and make things without to much computer stuff
then Mach3 is for you, if however you enjoy technical and programming challenges then Mach4 would be good.

Craig
Title: Re: Moving settings to another computer
Post by: RICH on September 21, 2017, 07:38:16 AM
Quote
Also, see the File menu in the upper right. There's a selection called "Entib."  What the heck is that???  When I click it, it brings up a Windows Media Player setup page.  

I have never seen the "Entib" listed under File in any of generic lathe screens.
Try this,  View>Load Screens and in the flyout under files of type, select Turn Files (*.lset) and then
select 1024.lset which is the generic lathe screen. The screen will load and see if Entib is still listed.
You may have a plug-in that adds that selection ......just a quess.


Mach3 or Mach4 what to buy...........?
Like Tweakie I will stick with Mach3 until the time comes when there is no choice but to upgrade.
I use custom screen sets, scripting, wizards and have invested a lot of time into Mach3 which is not transferable to Mach4. So nothing much to gained in upgrading for what I do.

Since your starting from scratch I tend to agree with Tweakie on deciding on Mach4.
Haven't followed Mach4 much and don't know exactly how devleoped the Lathe part is these days
and have no desire to invest in another external motion device that will sit with the other two in the drawer.
Hmm.........................maybe becoming "dated".  :D


RICH
Title: Re: Moving settings to another computer
Post by: Tweakie.CNC on September 21, 2017, 08:23:37 AM
The official word...

'Mach3's feature set is complete, while Mach4's will continue to expand.  If you are new to cnc, Artsoft highly recommends using and learning Mach4 even if it appears that Mach3's feature set will be adequate for your needs'.

Tweakie and Rich are just two Dina-saws  ;D

Tweakie.
Title: Re: Moving settings to another computer
Post by: ScotY on September 21, 2017, 02:18:02 PM
Thanks for the replies, guys. I am somewhat challenged with a lot of things and have some, very limited, experiencing using Mach3. So, sticking with Mach3 would be easier but I think it would just be wiser to suffer a little more and go with Mach4.

Does anyone know how to adjust the screen in Mach4?  It doesn't look right and I can't see the bottom of the screen. Tweakie told me how to fix it in Mach3 but haven't been able to sort it for Mach4.
Title: Re: Moving settings to another computer
Post by: ScotY on September 21, 2017, 02:21:59 PM
Sorry, also wanted to ask about the ESS. I followed the instructions on the Warp9 site and got it up and running on Mach3. Can you have the ESS running on the same computer and run the lathe on Mach3 and the mill on Mach4, just by swapping the ESS between both machines and without changing anything on the ESS?  Hope that makes sense?  I was planning to buy a new motion controller but just sank my budget so that will have to wait a bit.

Also, does anyone have a Mouser part number for the ESS's power plug?

Thanks!
Title: Re: Moving settings to another computer
Post by: joeaverage on September 21, 2017, 02:46:17 PM
Hi,
I think you could use the ESS that way. Most who use one ESS/PC for two different machines use the same version of Mach. Both varieties allow you
to run different profiles and each profile 'programs' the ESS firmware so the fact that one lot of firmware is Mach4 oriented and the next lot Mach3 oriented
won't matter a damn to the ESS.

I suspect you would need multiple BoBs, one for each machine and plug the correct one in prior to using that machine.

My goto electronics supplier is Element14, can't help with Mouser.

Craig
Title: Re: Moving settings to another computer
Post by: joeaverage on September 21, 2017, 03:04:51 PM
Hi,
just been fiddling with Mach4s screen size....

Operator/Edit Screen....select your screenset, the topmost entry in the Screen Tree Manager...select properties rather than events in the Properties panel
and there will be displayed Design Width and Design Height. My current screen set was 1024 x 768. If I enter 780 <enter> and the exit screen edit by saving I'm done.
Note after typing your desired height in the text box hit <enter> otherwise the new data will be ignored. Now when I fire up Mach it appears on screen at 1024 x 780.

This is a small tweak but you should save it to a screen set with a distinct name and use that set in your profile. Otherwise when you next update Mach4 the standard
screen set, wx4 for instance, will be overwritten which includes all your little tweaks and they will be lost.

Craig
Title: Re: Moving settings to another computer
Post by: ScotY on September 21, 2017, 08:32:02 PM
Thanks, Craig.  I tried to follow along and the screen editor page seemed to change so that I could see the bottom portion.  I'm using 1024x600 as that's what my display is set to.  I went to Screen->Save Screen and restarted Mach4, it took a little while to start up, and the main screen hasn't been fixed.  Confused...

I need to familiarize myself with Profiles and such as I understand what you're saying, but only in theory.  

The netbook I'm trying to use has an Atom 1.66GHz processor, 1 GB RAM, running 32-bit Windows 7...not sure what kind of video card.  This is less than recommended on the Artsoft website.  Anything I will be doing will be simple parts.  Is this computer going to be enough or is it marginal?
Title: Re: Moving settings to another computer
Post by: ScotY on September 21, 2017, 08:54:47 PM
I found the View->Load Screen selection and I can see more of the screen but some panels are overlapping. Strange.
Title: Re: Moving settings to another computer
Post by: joeaverage on September 21, 2017, 09:17:28 PM
Hi,
I think you've adjusted the wrong way, now there is only 600 pixels to squeeze in all your buttons etc, not going
to fit. Try going to 1024 x 800.

I use a little dual core Atom on my mill and it works fine. The only time I notice that it is such a low power CPU
is if I load large files, more than 5Meg, they take forever to load and draw the toolpath. If your patient and wait
for it to load its fine thereafter. If you do 3D carving with 100 Meg files your out of luck, for any normal
milling job your Atom will be fine.

Craig
Title: Re: Moving settings to another computer
Post by: joeaverage on September 21, 2017, 09:22:32 PM
Hi,
just to add, my Atom doesn't have a video card it uses on-chip graphics,way WAY under par for Mach but it works
fine. I suspect your Atom is similar, that was one of the selling points in its day that 'no video card required!'.
Smurph describes the graphics as awful, may be I'm just low class, I don't mind them.

Craig
Title: Re: Moving settings to another computer
Post by: ScotY on September 21, 2017, 10:24:09 PM
Thanks for the added info, Craig.  I've tried 800 and also 500, 1000, etc. and nothing really fixes it.  I've discovered that you can resize the individual panels and such, but it's like a complete redesign of the screen would be necessary to fix this.  If I resize a panel, then the individual buttons or titles for the panel are messed up.  This doesn't seem to be the way to go.

I don't quite get it.  Mach3 had a super easy one click fix.  Do you think there's some other function hidden somewhere that will just fix it without modifying everything?  I will have enough on my plate just to figure out how to use Mach4 without first having to learn to design my own screen. 
Title: Re: Moving settings to another computer
Post by: joeaverage on September 22, 2017, 12:07:12 AM
Hi,
when you say it doesn't fix anything do any of the adjustments show up at all. I suspect that your changes
are not being seen for some reason. It works perfectly here, and I would say this is a 'one step fix' provided
you don't go overboard otherwise the combined size of your button and panels would be bigger than the screen
you allowed for them.

I like this way of dealing with it, I set the size and it stays that way...

Craig
Title: Re: Moving settings to another computer
Post by: ScotY on September 22, 2017, 02:07:24 AM
Hi Craig,
I am seeing the effects of the changes in screen size. If I go higher than (going from memory...bad memory) say 600 and even up to 800+ I can see almost the bottom of the screen but some panels are covered like in the pic. If I go lower, say around 500, about half the screen isn't showing. I'll post some pics in a few.
Title: Re: Moving settings to another computer
Post by: joeaverage on September 22, 2017, 02:22:43 AM
Hi,
I would expect that if the problem is to be solved using this method the percentage change should be small.

If you have 10 buttons arranged vertically of 40 pixels width and another 40 pixels between each you would need 760 pixels vertical to display them without a
margin at top or bottom. If you then say the page is now 700 pixels high how are you going to fit all your buttons in? You could as you say go and scale
all of them but is very tedious. I think any changes made should be within 5% of the nominal number of pixels that the screen designer had in mind.

I can adjust the size of the screen to the extent that the last error text field is visible or not depending on the setting. I'm beginning to think that a small alteration may
be all that is possible this way. I have not encountered any other means either.

Craig
Title: Re: Moving settings to another computer
Post by: ScotY on September 22, 2017, 02:38:36 AM
Maybe I didn't understand the process?  I'm going to Operator-Edit Screen, then click on wx4, change Design Height, hit enter, then Screen-Save Screen, then back to Operator-Edit Screen (off).  

I do understand what you are saying about the changes needing to be small for this to work.  I've been changing the height in small increments and somewhere around 760 is where it needs to be to see the entire screen.  Any lower and the History, Profile, and Screen line is cut off.  I'll post a pic.  Take a look at the buttons.
Title: Re: Moving settings to another computer
Post by: ScotY on September 22, 2017, 03:04:51 AM
After all that, I discovered the Minimal screen and that's good enough with the stock display settings!  Thanks and appreciate the patience, Craig!

EDIT: Disregard, I found where to uninstall.  ;D
Now, I'd like to uninstall and reinstall to start clean.  It's odd, but I see Mach3 in the uninstall programs but don't see a Mach4?  Strange.  Is it "safe" to just delete the Mach4Hobby off the hard drive and reinstall, or will this cause problems?
Title: Re: Moving settings to another computer
Post by: joeaverage on September 22, 2017, 03:22:49 AM
Hi,
good question, I've never had to delete the lot and start again. As far as I know there are no hidden files or quirks to trip you up.

Craig