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Mach Discussion => Mach4 General Discussion => Topic started by: TOTALLYRC on March 06, 2016, 10:13:41 AM

Title: Upgrading from MACH3 to MACH4 with a DSPMC/ip V2
Post by: TOTALLYRC on March 06, 2016, 10:13:41 AM

Hi Guys and Gals,
I am making the long overdue switch to MACH4.
I have a nice new DSPMC/ip V2 control box and I have it all setup on the bench making sure it all works before I install it. My goal is to have the least amount of downtime possible.

I will also be cleaning up some wiring that was done in haste when I got the machine running.

1. Updated the FPGA and firmware to the latest version.
2. Installed the latest version of MACH4 on a spare computer.
3. Setup the DSPMC, power supplies,breakout boards, terminal strip, and a fuse for the incoming power on a board. I did it this way so that the whole setup is portable, if I need to move off of the work bench I can.
4.Installed the latest DSPMC plugin in the plugins folder. The DSPMC is very particular about the plugin being suited for the firmware and I believe that it will now complain about a mismatch.
5. Deleted any unneeded plugins like Simulator and Modbus.
6. Went to the configure tab and configured the plugin to be active.
7. Deactivated any plugins that weren't needed.
8. Took pictures of my MACH3 config screens so I could transfer all the settings.
9. Configured MACH4 with all of the MACH3 settings.
10. Took a picture of the Brains page so I could duplicate my brains in LUA.
11. Powered everything up and VOILA, no magic smoke!!!!!
12. Lo and behold, MACH is talking to my DSPMC!!!!!!
13. Configure the DSPMC plugin to match my MACH3 DSPMC configure settings including motor tuning and steps/unit.
14. Temporarily wire in the MPG on the control panel that I never wired in MACH3. This is wired to a hard encoder input because I will never us all 8 of them.
15. Spin the MPG and watch the numbers change on the screen. I don't have motor or drives hooked up yet but on the DSPMC diagnostic screen you can see the MPG info come in.
16. I will probably hook up a spare motor and drive prior to installing this on my machine.

More to follow.

Mike

Title: Re: Upgrading from MACH3 to MACH4 with a DSPMC/ip V2
Post by: TOTALLYRC on March 06, 2016, 10:22:16 AM

17. Work on the LUA scripting to make my control panel buttons work.


 ??? This is where the problems start. Could anyone show me how to have a physical button on my console turn on an output?

Not one of the prewired ones like coolant or spindle but just a generic output like a MACH3 OEM

Example.
[mc.mcinsig_input] BLA BLA BLA [mc.mcosig5]




I think that something like this will work for the basic stuff



 

SignalTable = {
 [mc.ISIG_INPUT1] = function (on_off)
 if (on_off == 1) then 
mc.mcCntlCycleStart(inst)

 [mc.ISIG_INPUT2] = function (on_off)
if (on_off == 1) then
 mc.mcCntlCycleStop(inst)

[mc.ISIG_INPUT3] = function (on_off)
if (on_off == 1) then
 mc.mcCntlFeedHold(inst)

[mc.ISIG_INPUT4] = function (on_off)
if (on_off == 1) then
 mc.mcCntlEStop(inst)

[mc.ISIG_INPUT5] = function (on_off)
if (on_off == 1) then
 mc.mcCntlCycleStop(inst)
[mc.ISIG_INPUT6] = function (on_off)
if (on_off == 1) then
 mc.mcCntlCycleStop(inst)
 
 end
end
}

TIA

Mike

Title: Re: Upgrading from MACH3 to MACH4 with a DSPMC/ip V2
Post by: TOTALLYRC on March 06, 2016, 11:06:17 AM

Just realized I posted this in the wrong area.

Title: Re: Upgrading from MACH3 to MACH4 with a DSPMC/ip V2
Post by: Tweakie.CNC on March 06, 2016, 11:29:52 AM

Moved  ;)

Tweakie.

Title: Re: Upgrading from MACH3 to MACH4 with a DSPMC/ip V2
Post by: TOTALLYRC on March 06, 2016, 03:09:53 PM

Thanks
Tweakie.

See what happens when you wake up with a cold.

Mike

Title: Re: Upgrading from MACH3 to MACH4 with a DSPMC/ip V2
Post by: TOTALLYRC on March 16, 2016, 10:22:30 PM

Here is what I have done since the last update.

1. Decided that I needed to put the machine back in its' nook. Have to pull it out to access the cabinet where the DSPMC sits.

2. Decided that I can finish the button scripting when the machine is doing everything and not sticking in the walkway of my shop.

3.Installed Win7 home premium on the computer. (Looks like the DSPMC will not run on XP)

4.Installed the DSPMC and the breakout boards into the machine cabinet.

5. Installed a nice piece of DIN rail to hold a small DB25 BOB to handle the wiring for MPG.

6. Added some nice terminal strip to improve the layout of the wiring and the appearance of it as well.

7. Added wiring for the FRO, RRO, and SRO from the breakout board to the control panel. It is wired to the breakout boards and taped off inside the control panel.

8. Figured out how to make mistakes and then fix them. Mark at Vital System was a great help in figuring out what I did wrong. Thanks Mark!!!!!!!

9. Repaired some iffy wiring that I had made the when I set up the machine.

10. Configured Mach4 and the DSPMC plugin to match how Mach3 was setup.

11. Test Jog the axis, test run the spindle.

So far so good. More to follow.

Mike

Title: Re: Upgrading from MACH3 to MACH4 with a DSPMC/ip V2
Post by: TOTALLYRC on March 19, 2016, 12:27:40 AM

More updates.

Well, It is back in its niche and almost ready to run. I was able to make a new page on the screen and figure how to get it to run Gcode.
WOW, is G28 a lot different in Mach4 than it was in Mach3. After reading the Mach4 manual about Gcode I was able to make it work. First I test ran the code in the MDI and then I was able too put it in a button script and it works!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Tomorrow I will buy my license. While test running the road runner it suddenly stopped.I almost panicked and then remembered that in demo mode it just randomly stops running code.

Here's to another great day with Mach tomorrow.

Mike

Title: Re: Upgrading from MACH3 to MACH4 with a DSPMC/ip V2
Post by: TOTALLYRC on March 19, 2016, 02:03:45 PM

Purchased Mach4 today. It took longer to remember my Paypal password than it did to complete the transaction. License file showed up right away. Very painless. I just need to remeber the limits on how many times I can generate a new file. If you like playing with the computer or changing out stuff you could run out of the lifetime number of regenerations. A change of operating system or replacement of the network card can invalidate your license.


Time to figure out why the coolant isn't working.

Mike

Title: Re: Upgrading from MACH3 to MACH4 with a DSPMC/ip V2
Post by: ger21 on March 19, 2016, 03:49:09 PM

Quote

If you like playing with the computer or changing out stuff you could run out of the lifetime number of regenerations.

You supposedly get 7 I think, and then you can call and get more if you need it.

Mach4 has already changed the licensing scheme 3 times I think, which burned 3 licenses. Then I got a new PC, so that's 4. If I were to use it on a machine, that would be another PC and I'd be at 5, to run one machine.
I asked on the Yahoo group if we could delete unused licenses.
I was told that you could, but the last time I checked you could not.

Title: Re: Upgrading from MACH3 to MACH4 with a DSPMC/ip V2
Post by: Steve Stallings on March 19, 2016, 05:03:56 PM

Recent builds of Mach4 are supposed to be less sensitive to changes in OS or minor hardware
changes on your computer triggering the need for a new license.

The current policy regarding self-issued Mach4 license files for each license purchased is:

>Maximum of 5 active at one time. Old or unused licenses can be deactivated. Commercial
  users running machines to produce product for sale are expected to purchase a license
  for each machine used in production.

>Maximum of 7 license files issued in a single year.

>Lifetime limit of 12 new self-issued license files.

This policy is documented here:

http://www.machsupport.com/my-account/license-maintenance/license-maintenance-instructions/

Title: Re: Upgrading from MACH3 to MACH4 with a DSPMC/ip V2
Post by: TOTALLYRC on March 19, 2016, 10:09:18 PM

Hi Steve,
While I am certain that they have made things more tolerant the big problem is should you have to change your network card. Last I looked you have to have a funtional network card in the computer. If you disable it or remove it the license will fail.


On a brighter note i just did my first cuts with Mach4. ;D

The machine will run faster than ever but I am not thrilled with the PID tuning at low speeds. I will be sending Vital System an email to see if they have any insight as to why it runs great at high speed, and I mean high(750ipm) but is less than stellar at low. At anything less than 20 ipm the servos are noisy and the PID tuning is significantly different than it was running Mach3. Maybe they changed the algorithm or something.

I will need to either learn to do some LUA scripting or I will need to hire someone to write a few scripts.

Things like manual tool release & air blast, coolant, and cycle start from some actual switches, not screen buttons.

Hi Gerry,
With 12 lifetime licenses, and 4 machines in the shop, a couple of computer upgrades per machine and a goof or 2 and you are out of them. That being said they have had a lenient policy in the past and I am sure a phone call and a good solid explanation of what is going on will get you a few more. Obviously they are trying to catch the guys who buy one license and then share it with 50 of their closest friends.

Mike

Title: Re: Upgrading from MACH3 to MACH4 with a DSPMC/ip V2
Post by: ger21 on March 19, 2016, 11:42:59 PM

As I said, those of us who purchased it early (18 months ago) already went through 3 before it was even really ready to use.

Title: Re: Upgrading from MACH3 to MACH4 with a DSPMC/ip V2
Post by: TOTALLYRC on March 20, 2016, 06:41:04 AM

Hi Gerry,

Agreed.

Title: Re: Upgrading from MACH3 to MACH4 with a DSPMC/ip V2
Post by: TOTALLYRC on March 23, 2016, 06:07:28 PM

Vital systems to the rescue.
They remote connected in to my computer and were able to figure out that the PID tuning was off. Using a lot less P and more I really woke the low speed up. It is now whisper quiet at low speeds and very stable past 500ipm.

More to come.

Mike

Title: Re: Upgrading from MACH3 to MACH4 with a DSPMC/ip V2
Post by: TOTALLYRC on March 26, 2016, 10:13:31 PM

Happy Easter to all of you following my trials and triumphs.

Fresh in from several hours of running making some parts to help a friend and here is the report.

The good. ;D
Motion is excellent and better than ever. Machine ran for 12 hours without crashing over the course of several days. Win7 on a Dell SFF SX270. Not bad for a $50 computer.
Feed hold response is excellent. In Mach 3 you had to wait for the buffer to empty before motion would come to a noisy halt. Now it just stops like is supposed to do.

Was cutting with a .250 3fl ZrN carbide endmill 18k rpm with a .050 doc and .250 woc at 95 ipm. Could have gone faster but with a 1.5" stickout I didn't want all the flex.

The not so good. :(
Coolant will stay on even if you E-stop the machine or disable the machine. Not the end of the world but something that i would like to see fixed.
At the present time it is not honoring the coolant delay setting that I have setup on the general config page. I need to verify a few things before I file a bug report.

The needs to be done. ???
Lua coding for the all of my hardwired buttons. I wound up having to fudge the tool release so I could change tools. Probably not the safest thing so I won't go into detail on how I did it. I want to incorporate an interlock so I can't release the tool at 18K RPM.

 I also need to connect my spindle rpm output to the DPSMC input so I can read the RPM. There is not a spindle ramp delay setting to make the machine wait for the spindle to come up to speed. If Mach4 can read the rpm then you can make it wait until the spindle is at a certain percentage of speed and then the machine will go. Between not have the spindle rpm being read into mach and the coolant delay not working, I had to add in a delay to my code after every toolchange. (5=ms. 5. =sec Decimal or not is very different)The machine now moves so fast at full rapids that it can rapid to the opposite side of the table and start cutting before the spindle is at full speed or the coolant has decided to flow.

The nice to have done. :P
Wire servo drive and spindle drive faults to stop the machine if a drive faults.
New screen set. The grays on blues on grays has no contrast and no appeal to me.
I also hate having to go from the run tab to the jog tab to the file tab and back. I don't have a real mouse on this machine just a joystick that does mouse emulation as part of the keyboard.


Since I have the DSPMC with the Analog inputs I would like to have RRO, FRO and SRO. I also should be able to get from the spindle VFD a signal indicating spindle load and read it into Mach. Same thing with the servo drives.


More to come,
Mike

Title: Re: Upgrading from MACH3 to MACH4 with a DSPMC/ip V2
Post by: smurph on April 07, 2016, 03:47:45 AM

Sounds like it is coming along!!  Anymore progress Mike? 

Title: Re: Upgrading from MACH3 to MACH4 with a DSPMC/ip V2
Post by: TOTALLYRC on April 07, 2016, 05:36:26 AM

Hi Steve,
Somebody should have been sleeping instead of posting >:D

I made some parts to help a friend and it ran ~60 parts really well. No hiccups, no stutters and no problems.

I am currently making a coolant block to hold 4 smaller nozzles around the perimeter of the cut path instead of always having to move a noxxle to get the flow just right. At 18Krpm it doesn't take long to weld the cutter into the part if it runs dry.

I will be working on this over the next few weeks to make all the improvements listed. The Biggest one is to get the hardwired buttons working with all the safeties worked out so I can't drop the tool while the spindle is turning.

I was testing Chaotione's probing GUI which would work a lot better on a proper computer but now I have to go back to making things. I did however put the probing jack in the operators panel since I couldn't fish the wires from the control cabinet to the inside of the machine. It was easy to get from the control cabinet to the operators console.

Things to make this week. :o
1. Coolant block. In process
2. Fullsized vacuum table for PCBs and the like. Bought some nice 3/4" sanded one side plywood.
3. Dust shoe for those times when I have to do a dry materiel like wood or PCBs, don't want all the wood residue to interact with my coolant and make the machine a real mess. More of the plywood that I bought.
4. Full sized fixture plate. I hacked one together but now I need to make it properly. Fully machined and possibly a grid pattern of holes.
5. Low overall length touch probe. I don't have a lot of Z to begin with and the wildhorse probe stuck into a er-16 collet holder eats most of it.

Longer term I need to figure out the ATC. The wine rack style it came with uses a ton of the y travel. Looks like it will be a rotary tool changer. I have a nice gear driven device with a small servo that should be perfect.


If there is anything I need to do and have not mentioned it, everybody please speak up. ::)

Please stay tuned ;D
Mike

Title: Re: Upgrading from MACH3 to MACH4 with a DSPMC/ip V2
Post by: TOTALLYRC on April 09, 2016, 10:23:15 PM

From my last post,


Things to make this week.  :o
1. Coolant block. In process.   
2. Fullsized vacuum table for PCBs and the like. Bought some nice 3/4" sanded one side plywood.
3. Dust shoe for those times when I have to do a dry materiel like wood or PCBs, don't want all the wood residue to interact with my coolant and make the machine a real mess. More of the plywood that I bought.
4. Full sized fixture plate. I hacked one together but now I need to make it properly. Fully machined and possibly a grid pattern of holes.
5. Low overall length touch probe. I don't have a lot of Z to begin with and the wildhorse probe stuck into a er-16 collet holder eats most of it.

1. Broke a drill bit when I got carried away with the feed rate. Looks like I will need to start over.
2. Vacuum table has been roughed together. Still needs some sanding and some plumbing but it is looking good.
3. Made the first part of the dust shoe today. Machine cut the plywood very nicely at upwards of 200 ipm with a single flute straight cut router bit. We will see what tomorrow brings.
4. Fixture plate still on the list.
5. Looks like I will be able to take several inches out of the overall probe length. Stay tuned.

Long term has become shorter term. I jumped in to the winerack tool changer that came with the machine but it just took up way too much of the Y axis travel. I will be mocking it up in plywood until I have a solid idea of what I want to do. I also started working on the Lua coding that was supplied with Mach4 for a wine rack style tool changer. I changed the number of tools from 4 to 10 and I added the tool positions in X. More work needs to be done. Progress reports as they happen.

Title: Re: Upgrading from MACH3 to MACH4 with a DSPMC/ip V2
Post by: dude1 on April 10, 2016, 03:37:21 AM

you are going at a good speed

Title: Re: Upgrading from MACH3 to MACH4 with a DSPMC/ip V2
Post by: TOTALLYRC on April 10, 2016, 08:48:34 AM

Thanks Blockhead.

One thing I forgot to mention was that I took a good look at the rotary tool changer and I just don't have the room in the enclosure for it. I will save the rotary device that I have for another project.

Title: Re: Upgrading from MACH3 to MACH4 with a DSPMC/ip V2
Post by: dude1 on April 10, 2016, 03:46:42 PM

put it on a out rigger

Title: Re: Upgrading from MACH3 to MACH4 with a DSPMC/ip V2
Post by: TOTALLYRC on July 30, 2016, 07:54:49 PM

More news from DSPMC land.

The new PMC from the Mach4 guys has made getting all of the console buttons hooked up and it was almost painless. The only real complaint against the PMC is the lack of cut, copy, and paste. That being said I took it like a man and just did it long hand and got it over with. Since getting the switches working was so easy I decided to replace some non-functional switches with some nice chrome ones from Amazon. All I need to do now is connect the wiring.

If you have used ladder logic in the past you will be right at home with the PMC.

On another note, I actually read the manual today and was able to get my MPG functional. Now I just need to fine tune the selections i.e. do I want .0001, .001, and .010 or ????

More to come as I get back into the swing of working on my stuff again.

Mike