Machsupport Forum
Mach Discussion => General Mach Discussion => Topic started by: nobby on November 17, 2014, 09:48:41 AM
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http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/4-Axis-USB-CNC-Mach3-E-CUT-Motion-Controller-Card-24V-Interface-Breakout-Board-/281419748494?pt=UK_BOI_Industrial_Automation_Control_ET&hash=item4185ec948e
does that mean if its set to 24 volts for step and direction signals to servo drives, you can connect it network rather than usb
I can't understand it. Is it either or - I mean if you have one with powered 24volts and not powered by the 5v from the usb, do you then connect it network?
or do you still need to send it usb
so I simply need one of these a 24 volt power supply, can it be a little thing on a plug? - network address, panasonic minas a4 200w - 70mm pcd - 11mm shaft
you don't get a 24v power option in a pc power supply do you? i.e. hide this card in the bottom of the computer tower?
wireless network
run a servo stystem
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my mistake, it doesn't say anywhere that the step and direction - pulse train is 24 volts - but it must be???
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Don't buy cheap Chinese products with no support or documentation.
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The step/dir will almost certainly be 5v, it is the standard, it will be the I/O that is 24v.
Agree with Ger, buy cheap and get a headache for free.
The hardware may be cheap but almost certainly the manual and support will be non-existent. Also plugins tend not to support all of Machs functions and the ones they do support can work differently than Machs standard way of working.
Hood
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what i sthe I/O ?
thanks
ddoes it mean this
Use external 12V-24V DC power supply to isolate USB and external port,
usb in @ 5v and external port - 3 axis step and direction?
everything else is 24v?
i still don't get it
can a tb6600 chip function with 24v inputs?
i mean what on the card needs 24 volts?
home switches?
spindle function?
looks like it only cam out three weeks ago.......................
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I/O is Inputs and Outputs.
Yes they will be 24v, it is much better than 5v if implemented properly due to its increased immunity to noise issues. That is the reason most, if not all, industrial machines will use 24v.
Hood
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oh,I see so it means it isolates the computers external port and the input on the card at 5v usb
-the usb connection cannot be 24v
it optoisolates them, but they are still output at 5v, the breakout board uses its own power at 24v
to run everything else - step and direction is 24v
limit switches 24v
so in theory it could be alright for servo drives wanting 24v pulse train step and direction.
so if I have 200 watt servo drives with 70 - odd volts up the wires @ 2 amps
I am going to have 24 volts in the limit switching - do I then have to up the guage of the wireing of the limit switches to 1.5mm core, or is .5mm core wire ok @ 24v
PLUS is the cabling on a 200 watt 71volt 2 amp motor to servo drive 2.5mm or can oit be 1.5 = do I have to still sheild the wires with and use cy cable.
I think I am ok with the servo malarky, the only thing that is bothering me now is I suppose the most critical - and at first I poverlooked it completely
but they list them as high inertia - medium inertia and low
/\ I don't get that....... I just want to servo up my little 2 foot bed machine
the good thing is the panasonic minas a4 @ 200w has a motor bolt pitch circle 'on the diagonals at 70mm - the nema 23 is 68 - so not too far off
why is the stator so fat though at 11mm over 6mm or even 8mm.
can I lop a bit from the motor shaft length or does this effect the balance.......
/\ sorry
is the very idea of running servos you need not sheild the wires and that the drives have a battery in them so even when you switch the machine off, it still hold homing information ?
they don't run at the full voltage all the time do they? - the voltage listed on them is simply the max? - so If it needs the max volts IT can IF it needs to pull it?
is the whole idea about servo motors and drives - the hall positioning will only work at 24 volts 'well''
apologies - just trying to get meheed around it.
is 200w too much foor a littl emachine?
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As said prevously, Step/Dir will almost certainly be 5v, possibly differential, all other digital I/O will be 24v, if it has analogue I/O then it will likely be 0-10v.
I have not looked properly at the link you gave as the info on there is poor and it is what you should expect from the customer service from such a vendor, but that is up to you, if you want to take a risk then go for it ;)
Hood
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Ok Mr. Hood,
I get it, the board out puts step and direction still at 5v
the 24v aspect is merely for 24v limit switching for people experiencing interferance when using the computers 5v for limit switching
I don't have spindle control, so I would only guess that you need a 10v analougue signal for spindle control, that yoiu can't then do at 5v computer.
plus i suppose the e-stop would benefit from not being fed 5v from the pc too and favor 24v.
oh bugger, back to the starting board then, why oh why do they picture the panasonic minas system then and say its ok for servo drives, when they need 12-24v
is it something to do with 800 khz over the 200 of the earlier usb break out boards.
Thank you for your time
-its deffo not a network connection - i think that plug must be for a hand wheely thing
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Are you sure the Minas are 24v Step/Dir?
I have not looked at their specs but that is unusual, more normal that they would be 5v differential input.
Hood
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Hello again
its specifically the
PANASONIC MINAS A4 200W DRIVER
MADDT1207
that interests me.
90.1v
/\ not the 003 extension - as thats digital only - not the 'p' as that position only
I think its perfect for my little table that runs nema 23's at the moment.
I just WANT - don't need to fit a servo system, bit stoopid really.
I can't find any info to suggest it willwork 5v
maybe it will though?
http://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&frm=1&source=web&cd=1&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0CCMQFjAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Findustrial.panasonic.com%2Fww%2Fi_e%2F25000%2Ffa_ctlg_minas_a4_e%2Ffa_ctlg_minas_a4_e%2FA4e_01s.pdf&ei=93NsVIiZK8_qaJrIgFA&usg=AFQjCNHk3vF0w-GGTgrxHuJB4ANTyC-o1Q&bvm=bv.80120444,d.d2s
http://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&frm=1&source=web&cd=8&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0CE8QFjAH&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.techdrives.co.uk%2FMultimedia%2FPanasonic%2520Servo%2520Systems%2FPanasonic%2520AC%2520servo_driver%2520MINAS%2520A4%2520series.pdf&ei=93NsVIiZK8_qaJrIgFA&usg=AFQjCNFAel8hSifK8YNofmHtkoTbUsxIVQ&bvm=bv.80120444,d.d2s
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I can not find a manual, just some data sheets that are not too specific.
The I/O will almost certainly be 24v as is the case with most industrial type drives.
The sheet I found suggested the pulse/direction was line driver which would suggest that it is looking for a 5v differential input, ie 5v differential Step/Dir. That is by far the most common Step/Dir setup in industrial drives although I have seen some such as Baldor having 24v Step/Dir.
Hood
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aha, think i have it
the encoder feed from the motors to the drive is 24 volts - thats the confusing part?
step and direction pulse train is always 5 volts
driver sends upto 90 volts to the drive side of the motors.
break out board wants 24 volts to stabilise limit switches - spindle control - e-stop, this is opto isolated sheilded away from the 5v
usb feed from the pc to the input on the drive, thus making it a cleaner signal? so you don't get any noise from the limits - e-stop - spindle interfering with the stepp and direction for the drive .............ahhhhhhhhhhh
so i need 3 motors - some wire, 3 drivers, one of them bobs, a 24v psu.
3 motor mounts with a 70mm pcd, some couplers 11mm to 1/4''
bolton
why am I doing this?
can I send you a drawing and you mill me some mountings £ price please
I am thinking I can 'almost' have a laminated 3 times 15mm plate alloy affair = 45mm motor mount
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yay,
those who wait...........
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/111549207664?_trksid=p2059210.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT
blam, that is almost £53 quid each -delivered!!!
prAy tell Mr .Hood I have the choise of purchasing the motors with two differing encoders
P- incremental pulse counts = 2500P/r resolution 10000 - wires 5
or
S Absolute -pulse counts = 17 bit - resolution 131072 - wires 7
do I simply get the higher resolutoin. -do I need to be running mach4 with a ethernet 100mbps connection
are there any network mach 3 break out baords with gigabit network 1000 whatsname speed
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It will all depend on the drives as to what they can handle. Assuming they can handle both then it wouldnt really matter too much.
Hood
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Hello Again Mr. Hood,
I has just dawned on me why there isn't so much servo talk here on machsupport - Is it simply due to servo systems being 220volt, and in the \u\sa its 110v - so If you like its 'LIKE' them 'LIKE running 3 phase 415?
hmmm, no wonder there is very little info to glean,
Thank yoiu
p.s. its information 'like' do I need to run limit switching with a servo system that has positioning encoders?
do 'most' of them have programmable limits - simply set the table size if you like, similar to sheetcam.
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In the USA I believe they have 2 lives of 110v and a neutral, so they can get 220v by using the 2 lives rather than a live and neutral as we do in the UK.
You should always have limit switches, if you have absolute encoders and they are battery backed up then it may be possible to do without home switches. That would depend on the drives and also whether you could communicate the home position to Mach effectively.
Hood
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https://industrial.panasonic.com/ww/i_e/25000/minas_a4_e/minas_a4_e.pdf
ok so page 98............
yokogowa electric?
usb feed from computer at 5v
5v power supply for pulse train out put - that to me means step and direction?
cw + from plc/breakout boardto pin 4
cw minus to pin 3
ccw plus to pin 6
ccw - to pin 5
- 5v opto isolated from 24 v
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then using a 24 volt power supply, into a 24 volt breakout board go
e stop pin 7
alarm
limit switches
is it that simple?
24 v power supply to breakout board
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Ok it is late here so dont want to read through the post again to see what you have. If I recall though your board has line driver output.
If that is the case then you would connect as in Pg 84 PI 1 (1)
Hood