Machsupport Forum
Mach Discussion => General Mach Discussion => Topic started by: graziano on July 17, 2012, 06:53:41 PM
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Hello to Everybody,
I'd need a pendant or more than a pendant by which I can manage manually 3 axles in a indipendent way.
I summarize the features for each axis:
a)Joystick forward and reverse
b)Selector for resolution: 1/100-1/10-1mm
c)Selector for movement of the axis: continuous mode and single step
This mean I should have the possibility to move the 3 axles with dedicated joystick, dedicated resolution and dedicated mode of movement.
Is there someone who can help me if Mach3 does really manage these feature and how to do it?
Thank You in advance
Regards,
Graziano
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Not sure on the joystick as I have never used one but the other two things you want are easy enough if you have spare inputs. You can do that via a Brain or macropump, Brain being the easiest. For the Cont/Step all you will do is have the Brain look at the inputs and depending on which one is seen it will act as if it presses a button as you would on the screen. The other one (resolution) is also easy, the Brain would just look at the inputs and then write the desired value to the Step increment DRO depending on which input is seen.
I do both of these on all my machines but I use a MPG for the motion and not a joystick.
Hood
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Hi not sure if this is exactly what you want but I have been happy with mine
http://www.vistacnc.com/b01_pendant_P3/pendant_P3.htm (http://www.vistacnc.com/b01_pendant_P3/pendant_P3.htm)
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To nzinoz: beautiful pendant; thank you but no, it is not what I need, I need 3 axles indipendent control.
To Hood: thank you Hood, some considerations on your answer:
-Joystick can be replaced with buttons: does this solve the doubt?
-Spare input: yes I can use a Smooth Stepper controller to have enough inputs
-Please, what are a Brain and a Macropump?
-When you say You did these things on your pendant you mean you put 1 MPG+resolution control+movement control dedicated to each axis?
Thank You
Graziano
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It all depends on what you are meaning by "movement control dedicated to each axis"
On my control panels I have a MPG and rotary switches that select which axis I wish to move via the MPG, I also have a rotary switch that either puts the MPG in Velocity mode or puts it in to step mode at 1mm, 0.1mm or 0.01mm steps.
Hood
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Hello Hood, you have a pendant with
-1)a rotary encoder
-2)a rotary switch related to the rotary encoder by which you choose the movement mode: single step (and 3 resolutions 0,01-0,1-1 mm) or velocity mode.
-3)a rotary switch by which you select the axis (X-Y-Z).
What I need:
Assuming to use a rotary encoder instead of a Joystick I asked at the beginning of the post:
1)3 Rotary encoders (One for X , One for Y, One for Z)
2)3 Rotary switches (related to the encoders X-Y-Z) by which I select the resolution 0,01-0,1-1mm or the velocity mode.
What I ask:
Is it possible to obtain this kind of configuration?
Can we use a Joystick or button instead of the rotary encoder?
Thank You,
Graziano
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It should be possible, as I mentioned I have no experience with the joystick so I am not sure how you would connect that. With 3 MPG's it should work although as before I have never had that. Buttons would also work but I think there may be a problem with buttons if they are via the SmoothStepper as there may be a delay in there action.
For the rotary switch then that is easy, you just need position 1 going to an input in Mach and then have a brain look at that input and change it to Vel mode when it is seen. Input 2 on the switch would be seen by the Brain and it would change it to step and the desired step amount, input 3 would change to a different step value etc etc,
Hood
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Thank you Hood,
very kind of you.
To realize such a system, what hardware do I need and what software?
Thank You,
Graziano.
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The only hardware needed will be switches etc. No software needed other than Mach as Brains are part of Mach.
Hood
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Hood pardon but I am not an expert.
What I need is only to fill somewhere in Mach3 the number of the pin arriving from the hardware installed?
Have you time to tell me what are the screens or file to look in Mach3?
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Ok I will give you an example.
Rotary switch with 4 positions would then go to 4 inputs on the SS. You would then set them up in Ports and Pins, Inputs page as Inputs or OEM Triggers and assign the port and pin numbers you have them attached to.
Next Operator menu then Brain Editor to make a Brain.
Below is an example of a Brain to set the mode between Velocity and step and also to change the step increment when in step mode, I am using inputs 1 to 4 in this example but as mentioned you can use any that are spare or use OEM Triggers if you dont have any inputs spare.
Hood
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Hello Hood,
very and very kind of you, thank you very much.
I send these information to a friend of mine who is helping me and probably he can match everything.
I hope I will not keep you too much busy whit my questions.
Thank you
Graziano
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Given that the MPGs effectively issue jog commands, and, AFAIK, you can't issue a jog command while a jog command on another axis is already in progress, I fail to see the utility of such a setup.... You'd still only be able to move a single axis at any time. Sounds to me like a complicated, expensive solution in search of a problem....
Regards,
Ray L.
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Hello HimyKabibble,
about the utility: imagine to use a cnc lathe but you want to move it manually.
If you have 2 joysticks, one for the long axis and one for the traverse slide, with different movement mode, i.e. in the left hand the joystick of the long axis, mode continuous and in the right hand the joystick of the traverse slide,setted up in single steps, 1 cents, you can use Mach3 as a dro, have a zero point etc. and you can turning fast without mistakes because you know at each pressure of the joystick the traverse will move 1 cent.
If you use a common pendant, a part the risk to forget to change the mode, you loose a lot of time.
Are you sure you can not use 3 axis simultaneously?
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Given that the MPGs effectively issue jog commands, and, AFAIK, you can't issue a jog command while a jog command on another axis is already in progress, I fail to see the utility of such a setup.... You'd still only be able to move a single axis at any time. Sounds to me like a complicated, expensive solution in search of a problem....
Regards,
Ray L.
As far as I am aware you can have up to 3 MPGs connected to Mach and move them all at the same time, granted you would need three hands ;D
Jogging via a keyboard you can jog all three axis together, in fact likely all 6.
I think but am not 100% sure, that with a joystick you can jog two axis at the same time by working it diagonally.
Hood
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3 Mpg..........., 3 hands,......it has sense, yes :).
But Hood,what do you mean by "diagonally"?
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As I said I am not familiar with the use of Joysticks in Mach but if your joystick can be moved at an angle it may be possible to jog two axis at one time.
eg normal directions would be North, South, East and West but it may be possible to move two axis by moving it North East or South West etc.
I remember looking at a joystick a long time ago but that was in Mach2 and I cant really remember how it was implemented, I seem to remember the keybrabber utility was used.
Hood
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Oh, no no Hood, I don't mean that kind of joystick.
What I mean is a stick which I can only move forward and backward or stay in a normal central position for no motion.
It is the same as a stick-switch with the 3 positions (forward-backward-central neutral).
Perhaps the right name is not "joystick"?
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Ah ok so basically what you are talking about is an On-Off-On momentary toggle switch?
If that is the case then you could easily set them up as X Y and Z jog buttons in Ports and Pins, Inputs page. (see screenshot)
However as this has to first go via the Smoothstepper there will likely be a delayed action to them so proceed with caution until you get a feel for it.
Hood
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Hello Hood,
thank you very much :).
The console we are speaking about (or the 3 axis indipendent pendant ,I don't know how to call it)
is to attach directly to the Usb port of the computer as a normal keyboard?
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You would have to connect these switches to the inputs on your Smoothstepper.
Hood
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At the moment I don't have a smooth stepper but I would like to buy it for the new machine.
Is it also possible to connect this console via usb so that I can use on more than a machine and so that I don't have to buy another smoothstepper for the machine I already have??
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Not unless you can write a plugin for your USB pendant.
You could use a second parallel port and connect it vis that. You can configure pins 2-9 as inputs on a second port so that would give you13 Inputs and 4 Outputs.
Hood
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Good Morning Hood,
Pardon, I have some matter with pins :)
-When you say: "Not unless you can write a plugin for your USB pendant" you mean I need an hardware interface such as an Arduino or a Pokeys or something similar?
-Second Paralle Port: the second parallel port is to be used to attach a pendant Non Usb therefore a Parallel Pendant to a second parallel port?
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Yes, you could use a PoKeys for the I/O to connect a pendant and use the PoKeys plugin to talk to Mach.
I made one up a few years ago with the PoKeys but for me a pendant was no use so I didnt use it, I prefer my controls to be on the panel. I had a document posted on how I made the pendant but the PoKeys plugin has changed a lot since then so it will likely not be much help but you will find it here.
http://www.machsupport.com/forum/index.php/topic,11817.0.html
Yes, you could connect the pendant directly to a second parallel port via a parallel port cable rather than using USB.
Hood
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Hello Hood, thank you very much for the information, I read the pdf and I ask my friend to try these hardware.
Yes, I understand your choise to have everything on a single panel; at the moment I am still understanding if it is bestter to have a 2 dedicated desktop pc or a laptop, I have to check.
Thank you very much Hood,
Graziano
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Personally I would go with a computer for each machine and that is what I have.
Hood
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Yes you are right.
At the moment I have no so much space; as soon as I make order and have the right space I will follow your council to have a dedicated pc, electronics and video for each machine. Not to forget a dedicated box, both for safety and soundproofing.
Let's do this little lathe and its consolle then we make order as professionals :)
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I have larger machines so its probably easier for me as I incorporate the computers into the electric panels. I use either Via Pico or Mini ATX motherboards, the Pico is tiny, only 100mm x 75mm but no parallel port so you need to use something like the Smoothstepper with it.
Heres a pic of the cabinet that I did for the Bridgeport, the mini ITX computer is lower righton the other side of that black plate
Hood
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Bridgeport? Already you are a professional!
That is a masterpiece of order, ability and very good electric components.
Very good work!
My Compliments! :)