Machsupport Forum
Mach Discussion => General Mach Discussion => Topic started by: Thys on May 06, 2011, 06:11:34 PM
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Hi Guys, I'm Thys. A newbie to this forum and to cncing. I have just built a mdf cnc machine, motors fitted, software loaded and drivers and power supply wired up etc, but I cannot get the motors to turn using simple g code to move them.
I have Mach3 loaded and am using g00 x1 and similar ro try and move the motors.
When I switched the power supply on for the motor drivers, I could hear them initialise and I even heard a little jump on the motor the first time I send a command through, but now nothing. I see the numbers moving on the computer screen, but no action on the cnc machine. Please could a ""saint"" help me!! Did I mention, it's midnight!
kind regards
Thys
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Double check your settings for the step and dir lines. you may have them reversed.
Just a thought, (;-)
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Hi Guys, some more details to my problem to help me diagnose the issue.
I checked the settings of step and dir lines and they seem fine as per my book (build your own cnc)
I have marked the e-stop value to 1 to 0.
Port 1 enable and number is 0x378
The problem which i am not able to sort out is getting windows xp to load the mach 3 driver.
- when I check the driver details in the device manager, it still says the old windows driver with a 2001 date or something. I tried to delete the driver and reload from the mach 3 software but still no luck.
do you guys think that this could be the issue..
if not, could it be the break out board, I am not sure how to isolate this to check if it is the issue. I have double checked my wiring and it all looks 100%.
Just a recap, the motors initialise, I can hear the sound they make when they kick in, the software shows the g code instructions i give it but the motors aren't turning,
thanks BR549 for your suggestions so far, please can anybody help me!
thanks
Thys
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Thys,
Run the 'DriverTest.exe' file in the Mach directory, if you have not already done so, this should check the drivers.
Check your parallel port cable with a multimeter to make certain that all pins are connected and that pin1 goes to pin1, pin2 to pin2 etc.
Tweakie.
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Hi Tweakie, I will do, I did run the test the other day and it said system excellent (if I remember correctly) , but I will run again to make sure. I will also test the parrallel port. I made it up myself so I need to check nothing have come loose etc.
If the driver test comes back ok, does that mean that there is no prob with the driver of the pc, or that everything is ok with the motor drivers on the board I built up?
If one pin or two is faulty on the parallel cable, would that maybe cause the problem I am currently experiencing?
thanks for your assistance so far.
regards
Thys
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Thys,
The driver test prog only tests your PC and its capabilities to run Mach. If the driver test runs then the drivers are installed OK.
If you built your own motor driver board then have you measured the outputs voltage from you computer's parallel port ? If it is 3.3 Volt then have you tested that your driver board will work reliably at this voltage ?
There are many different cables which have the DB25 connectors fitted and look like parallel port cables (some have a crossover function intended to connect two PC's together and some are just serial comm cables) so it is good to check that the one you are using has pin1 to 1 etc.
Tweakie.
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thanks Tweakie, will def test the parallel cable. I bought the breakout board and the motor drivers and motors from Keling (incl power supply for the motor drivers - output 36V measured and confirmed).
Please would you explain how and where to test for output voltage.
Out of interest, my board is powered by a 5v transformer. I did notice that when I plug the parallel cable into the board, I saw the power led light come on, on the breakout board. then when I switched the power on of the transformer (external power source) , the light shon a little brighter. Mean anything?
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Thys,
What make and model breakout board are you using ?
A picture would be helpful.
Tweakie.
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I am heading home for lunch soon, will take pic and post in an hour.
thanks for your assistance. so much appreciated.
Thys
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Hi Tweaky, tried to attach images but keeps giving me an error, could I email them to you?
Or any other way of getting them posted?
regards
Thys
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Yup, I keep getting an error trying to post a file on another thread.
email me tweakie@talktalk.net
Tweakie.
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thanks, just mailed you
Thys
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To all those reading this thread as reference purposes, please note that the sherline 1/2 pulse checked sorted out the problem. the motors are turning fine now. Tweaky was fantastic is assisting me patiently to isolate the problem.
May thanks to the adminstrators for setting up this forum. it was a life saver.
Heres to a long happy cnc journey!
Thys
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Thys,
Really glad you got it sorted.
Now the learning really begins. ;D
Tweakie.
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OK, I'm having the same issue so maybe you found something that I'm missing. I hear the motors energized (and I can't turn them once powered) I have the C10 break out board from Keling and KL-4030 Drivers. Parallel works fine 1 to 1 , the Estop and limit switches all work. I have the 1/2 Sherline checked and I've followed the setup instructions to a T. I completed the driver test and it said excellent, I did this three times for good measure. Any help would be great. After all of this my motors still do not turn whether I'm using G code or Jogging. Again, ANY help will be most appreciated.
Thanks
Brian
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Hi Brian, I am by no means the expert, but I do know the frustration of not getting your motors going. can you send me a pic of your wiring.
did you test your parallel cable with a multi meter?
under config in mach 3, ports and pins, input signals, did you check the estop to 0?
under the same section under motor outputs, have you set the direction and step pin numbers?
give me your email and I can send some wiring pics etc you to and other stuff which Tweakie sent me, which helped me in the end.
I really hope you are able to solve this soon, it's great playing with the cnc.
regards
Thys
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Thys,
I checked the cable, its 1 to 1, I changed the e stop from 0 to 1 because it wasn't working when it was a 0 I'll change it back to try it again since some settings have changed since then. My steps and directions are even numbers are steps and odd are directions. so 2, 4, 6 are steps and 3,5,7 are directions. The com is set to 5v but when I probe from com to a pin I only get 1.4v, I'm thinking about changing it so that it is plugged into a separate 5v supply to see if it's just a lack of voltage that's causing the issue, I'm optimistic but I don't think this will be the solution to my problem given that the break out board has it's own power supply of 5v ( just to clarify I'll be plugging 5v directly into the motor controllers and not the breakout board com pin)
Thanks
Brian
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Brian,
If you are measuring the voltage output from the computers parallel port then connect the multimeter between GND (0 Volts) and an Axis direction pin. The voltage should change between 5 volts (or 3.3 Volts) when the axis is jogged in one direction and 0 Volts when the axis is jogged in the other direction.
(the C10 can accept 3.3 Volt or 5 Volt inputs).
Tweakie.
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Update: Thy sent me some pictures of his set up which were VERY helpful, I apparently was missing the jumper from 5v to Eng Everything works great now, but now I have other problems which I'm not sure are problems. (They seem really loud) So off to searching the forums for that fix if there is one. Thank you both for your help!
-Brian
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Update #2: No the definitely are problems, my X motor turns about 5-10 turns and then stops but still sounds like it's turning, the Z does the same thing. As for the Y motor, it spins beautifully in one direction and when I jog in the other direction it sounds like a miss firing machine gun....::sigh::
Any ideas as to how to trouble shoot this?
PS I lowered my jog feed rate to 30% and it only helped the X motor, Z and Y were still acting funny.
Thanks
Brian
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hi Brian, I had the same issue as well but it was only with one axis. It would spin beautifully in the one direction and when I jogged in the other direction, it would still move very slowly in the same direction as before, but very noisily (like a misfiring engine)
I isolated the problem by checking if it was the motors or the drivers or the board. It seemed to be coming from the board so I changed the (board outputs to drivers) numbers from 4 / 5 to 6 /7, and moved the axis outputs from 6/7 to 8/9. (essentially not using the number 4/5 outputs from the board). I also the changed the ports and pins output for the relevant axees in MAch 3 number ports and pins.
Not sure if it all makes sense to you but I will send pics, which will explain it no prob if you dont understand what I am saying.
regards
Thys
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I see I'm going to try it, I think the problem may be that I am using too small gauge wiring, I'm going to change my wires to 18awg tonight and see if that helps. Right now my 5v signals are 24 awg and to my motors is two strands of 24awg which I think might be choking it. I read on a couple other forums that the sputtering is due to low voltage getting to the motors too so if the gauge switching doesn't help I'll try your method. Hopefully one or the other will work. Also you asked to see some projects, were you talking about in CAD form or actual finished projects?
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hi brian, hope you come right tonight. Any projects, planned or completed.
regards
Thys
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Motor tuning can be the culprit too. Too fast of an accel and or speed will cause stalling.
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Update #3: ::sigh:: OK, so it was not the size wire though I feel more comfortable with the larger gauge wire. I switched ports that the signals are coming out of and that did fix some of the problem. So here's whats going on now. When jogging at 30% (which I'm not sure that means anything to anybody) all three motors jog wonderfully. However when I plug in a Gcode, the motors sound like a 30cal machine gun going off and is awfully loud. Now, the Gcode I'm running looks like a tomb stone and It starts on the round side of it so I don't know if it smooths out once I get to the flat edges however given how loud these are I'm not sure I want to. So I'm googling like crazy to find a solution to this now... gotta love trouble shooting...
Ok Now here's my question, What is your dip switches on the motor controllers set at? I have 1-8 dip switches and all but 2 are up, so that should give me 3.0amp at 1 micro step. I'm thinking about changing it to 1/2 micro step but I wanted to hear what someone else had first
That is all for now
Thanks again for helping me get this far,
-Brian
ps after reading over some earlier posts of mine I apologize for my awful proof reading (or lack there of )
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hi Brian, i agree with fastest1 (quite appropriate name for this topic) your motors tuning could be too fast. i have run the motors too fast and that does cause a horribe noise. It would make sense that when jogging at 30% there is no issue but at full speed it is an issue.
to sort this out i need to know what lead screw pitch you are using (TPi) or (TPmm) and the what speed you have set your motors at in the Config - motor tuning page in mach 3 software. I think 1/4 microsteps are fine for what I am using but I am sure it differs from person to person and depends on the type of method you have used to move the move the axees. we are getting closer, so don't give up hope.
regards
Thys
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Update 4: Ok, after following the advice of Fastest1 and a few others, I tuned my motors a bit and I was able to get my motors to perform a gcode with little to no grinding noises. I think after a little more tuning I'll be confident in installing the motors and building my machine WOOOO WHOOOO! So thanks guys for your help I really appreciate it!
PS I also had to move my y channels from 4 & 5 to 8 & 9 this solved the problem in which the motor would turn great in one direction but horrible in another. - Thanks for the tip Thys
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Hi Brian, thanks for the update, I was wondering where you went!
great, I am pleased to hear it all worked out.
good luck with the next project
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To all those reading this thread as reference purposes, please note that the sherline 1/2 pulse checked sorted out the problem. the motors are turning fine now. Tweaky was fantastic is assisting me patiently to isolate the problem.
May thanks to the adminstrators for setting up this forum. it was a life saver.
Heres to a long happy cnc journey!
Thys
What do you mean "please note that the sherline 1/2 pulse checked sorted out the problem. the motors are turning fine now." What is sherline 1/2 pulse? Thanks for any help. Tony
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Sherline is an option you can choose, it makes the pulse 40uS wide so 25KHz kernel is the most you can use with it. Some drives require a wide pulse so it is needed for them.
Hood
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Thanks Hood. Where can I find the option? I don't see it in general Logic Config or Ports and Pins or Motor Tuning.
Tony
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You using Mach3?
General Logic page is from Mach2 I think.
If using Mach3 then its on the main Ports and Pins page from Config menu.
Hood
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Screenshot attached
Hood
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Thanks Hood. I was staring right at it for twenty minutes and never saw it.
Tony
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been there ;D