Machsupport Forum
General CNC Chat => Show"N"Tell ( Your Machines) => Topic started by: Hood on February 21, 2011, 05:05:39 PM
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I have a Boss 6.1 Bridgeport that was my second convertion to Mach, the first was a clapped out manual Bridgeport. I stripped all of the Bridgeport electrics/electronics and fitted the G201's, steppers etc that I had on the manual conversion. It worked well but when I finished the bigger Beaver mill I never used the Bridgeport, so it has been sitting idle for probably a year.
I have now decided to haul all the electrics off and start again, this time I am using servos and will be putting a servo on the spindle. The motor I have for the spindle is 3.5KW so I am hoping that will be big enough, I do have a bigger drive/motor (8KW) but I am keeping that for a spare just in case the Beavers spindle/drive die in the future.
Anyway this is as far as I have got so far, waiting on bits and pieces arriving from eBay and progress may be slow dependant on free time.
Hood
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If you have question, don't hesitate to ask Hood, he's very good at it ;D ;D
Jeff
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Thank Jeff, will have to look that guy up if I get stiuck :)
Hood
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Out of curiosity, where do you get your servos?
I keep looking on ebay in the hope of some reasonably priced smaller ones, but I've not found any yet!
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;D Good one, Jeff.
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mc
I have got most from eBay, they are scarce here in the UK but when they do come up they usually dont go too high. Of course the dealers are trying to sell them on eBay as well but obviously they dont have to pay to list them, or certainly cant be usual fees, as I have seen the same drives, same motors and same crazy prices week after week, month after month year after year. I have even see a couple that were wanting more for second hand ones than you could buy a new one from Rockwell for. Suppose they are just hoping some idiot comes along one day ;D
Hood
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Bit more progress, have the lower end of the board almost wired, the interface boards for the drives are fitted but I need to solder different plugs on the ends of the ones I bought from eBay. I have a relay board fitted, got that from a friend free of charge, thanks Russ :) Also have the PLC in place and a DC-DC convertor. The convertor is to change the 24v down to 5v so that I can keep the logic in my servo drives alive even if I E-Stop the system which would cut the mains to the drives. The bigger drive has mains standby so the 5v is not needed for it.
Hope to get the computer tomorrow, was supposed to be here today but because a network card was out of stock they never sent it and also never bothered telling me. I phoned up to tell them to cancel and they offered me Saturday delivery FOC and also a higher priced network card for no extra :)
I normally use the via Pico mobos but with this one I am thinking I may need two network adapters and as I am not keen on the USB kind I needed a PCI slot, so I have opted for an ITX mobo.
Hood
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thanks Hood for sharing this Experiences.
i have a question about servo spindle Driver .
Whether this is a three phase driver?
Amir
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Yes, the drive is a DSD-050HV which is 230-480V 3 phase, I have 415v 3 phase in my workshop.
Hood
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pls link for manual
Amir
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You should find the manual here http://literature.rockwellautomation.com/idc/groups/literature/documents/in/2098-in003_-en-p.pdf
Heres the latest pic, have the mobo fitted and the HDD is a 2.5 inch SATA fitted on a braket atthe side of the network card. Wont be much more progress for a while as I am waiting on some parts and they will be 4 or 5 weeks.
Still have to do all the machine side of things so may get some of that done.
Hood
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thx hood
i see you dont used from pico mobo ;)
i think this series is mini itx.
Amir
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Yes, I am likely going to need 2 network ports with this setup and the pico only has one and no expansion so I decided to go with a mini ITX.
Hood
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Hood, I love the work you do. Can't wait to see what tricks you have up your sleeves for this machine. Hope I can pick up a few ideas that I can use on mine.
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Well this is going to be a test bed machine, hopefully for future products ;) Cant say much more I am afraid.
Hood
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Looks nice Hood !
Glad to see you made use of the relay board, let me know if you need more relays although I think I sent extras.
Quite a compact cabinet. With your climate, I guess you'll benefit from any excess heat generated.
Will you be using shunts on this one ? If so, where would you put them ? Another cabinet possibly ?
Very tidy, a proud day. :)
Russ
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Yes Russ, got two boards from you and a load of either relays or sockets, can remember it was a while ago. I will likely be redoing the lathe and mill in the future so I am sure I will use up that spare relay board :)
Yes, heat would be nice ;D
Nope no shunts, motors are smallish, only 750W and I will be keeping the original 2.5:1 gearing. I tested it out a while back and got around 5m/min which although not fast it is twice what it is with the steppers but the accel is probably 8 or more times :) The Bridgeport has a tiny travels so it should be plenty and to be honest I dont think I will use it that much for real work unless the NC5 takes a dive.
Hood
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Not got a lot done recently as I have not been that well, recovering well now and have the control cabinets panel finished and also the have the control panel almost done, still have a bit of painting to do on it and thats about it, hope to get some time soon to make the arm to suspend it from then hopefully get everything in place and the wires hooked up.
The computer has been repositioned from the earlier pic, it is now sitting on the other side of the black plate with the hard drive and some connections for external wiring on the other side.
Hood
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Good to see you back at it and feeling better, my friend :)
Control panel looks fantastic.
What's the light blue (upper right) area on your touchscreen represent?
Dave
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That looks real nice, Hood! Very slick indeed.
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Thanks guys,
Dave, thats just the toolpath view.
Hood
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Ohhhh, is that the newest form of Mach (4?)?
Is that why I see characters in the window and the background is different colors?
Thanks,
Dave
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Yes well spotted Dave ;D That is the axis readouts in the toolpath window.
Hood
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Ah, very nifty! ;D
Dave
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Well not got much done to the Bridgeport, have a couple of small issues with the controller I will be using and I am waiting for them to get sorted before I take the panel down and fit it into the cabinet. Had thought about doing it anyway but really better if its at home as I will be able to test it out here during the evening.
Did get the control panel mounted and wiring run, cut the arm from some 4mm Alu sheet and welded it up.
Hood
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Oh also got some new spindle bearings from eBay, still in sealed bags and only £34 delivered :)
Hopefully will get them fitted tomorrow.
Hood
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Nice work
Is this still using Dovetails and leadscrews or has the slides and screws been upgraded too?
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It was originally a BOSS 6.1 so has chromed ways and ballscrews.
Hood
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Got the electrical panel fitted into the cabinet today. Wired up single phase just to test I had the wiring to the buttons and screen correct, next job will be to route the motor cables and fit and wire limits and run a heavier mains cable to the mill and it will be almost done.
Hood
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hi Hood
Please talk about the accuracy in your machine.
Amir
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Hi Amir, not really sure what you are meaning.
The servos encoder have 2000 line (8000 counts per rev) and the gearing on the axis is 2.5:1 with 5mm pitch screws so resolution will be 0.00025mm and I am hoping to get the tuning so I have a following error of 20 counts/20mS so that would mean the axis would trip if it was ever 0.005mm out of position.
Is that what you mean?
Hood
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yes
do you used c5 ballscrew in this machine?
and pls brand?
Amir
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It has the original Bridgeport ballscrews and I have no idea what class they are.
Hood
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:o Looking good Hood!!!
Brett
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Thanks Brett.
Hood
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Looks great! Good wiring job, too!
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Thanks Sam, each machine I do gets a bit neater in the wiring.
Hood
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The servos encoder have 2000 line (8000 counts per rev) and the gearing on the axis is 2.5:1 with 5mm pitch screws so resolution will be 0.00025mm and I am hoping to get the tuning so I have a following error of 20 counts/20mS so that would mean the axis would trip if it was ever 0.005mm out of position.
Hood
If you have been reached 5um accuracy then i must say congratulations and happy for you.
Amir
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I dont think I will get anywhere near that accuracy from the machine, that is the resolution and accuracy of the servo system, there is a lot of mechanics after that and its a Bridgeport so not exactly rigid in the first place ;D
Hood
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Still only have single phase connected but have tested out the Z Axis, its looking good with no backlash at all. In the vid linked below I am doing a move of 6mm at a rapid of 5m/min.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RTldulUtIOg
Hood
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Managed to get the spindle pulleys fitted and all axis tuned. Have X Y and Z at 6m/min rapids and 1200mm/s/s accel which seems about right for a smallish travel that the Bridgeport has. Did have it doing 10m/min but it was too fast and had to reduce the accel on X and Y or the drive would trip on bus over voltage so settled for the much faster accel with reduced rapids. I could fit shunts to the drives but dont think its worth it.
Worked out how I will fit the limits and home switch on X and Y and will hopefully get them fitted tomorrow.
Hood
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Hood,
It looks good! And certainly each machine you do gets better :)
A few questions:
I know a Smooth Stepper must be in there, but can't see it...?
Also, since you have all those buttons and particularly the FRO and SRO pots, I would assume a Pokeys should be in there, but can't see that one either.
Could you explain what are the buttons on the first raw at the top? SpinEn looks like enabling the spindle drive, but I would expect a On/Off switch and this looks like a momentary switch? And the other two, just curious what are they (Limit and Control)?
Oh... and does Russ sell those relay boards? Where can I acquire one?
Dan
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Thanks Dan,
No SS, its got a Scorpion in it.
FRO, SRO and all buttons are via the PLC so no PoKeys, I prefer everything to be 24v if possible, thats why I am making up the BOBs for my ESS as I like differential signals if 5v and 24v for other I/O.
Spin enable is a latching switch with LED ring round the button.
The limit one is an override so I can back off the limits. The limits dont go to Mach they are handled by the PLC, if a limit is hit the PLC takes the enables away from all drives and also sends an E-Stop to Mach. To back off the limits I have to press and hold that button and I can then jog off them.
Control is simply the button that powers up the computer and other bits and pieces.
I got a couple of relay boards from Russ, think he picked up four or five somewhere and he kindly sent me a couple.
Hood
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Hood,
So the Scorpion works with Mach3? With the Scorpion you are using one network card, what did you need the second one for? Do you have your PC connected to a network?
Where are you getting those panel buttons from?
Dan
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It works with Industry Controls software which at this point is very similar to Mach3, it just has some of the Rev4 stuff in it such as toolpath and faster update, think 50Hz as opposed to 10Hz of Mach.
Yes have all my machines networked to each other and my desk computer.
Got the buttons from eBay, cant remember the seller I am afraid but think he was from Hong Kong, will see if I can find the seller and post a link if I do.
Hood
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Its actually a UK seller, the ones on the lathe were Hong Kong but didnt like them so much, heres the ones on the Bridgeport.
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Metal-Vandal-Proof-Momentary-Push-Button-Switch-2A-250V-/180669765737?pt=UK_BOI_Electrical_Components_Supplies_ET&hash=item2a10c1d869
Hood
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Hey Dan, I'll look to see if I have another one of those boards to get rid of.
Where are you ? Israel ?
Hood, you still with Dolphin ? Any complaints ? I might purchase soon.
Thanks,
Russ
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Yes Russ, still use Dolphin for the lathe, I like it a lot and my only complaint really is it needs dxf but I believe the next version will support iges imports which will be better for me, Dan can fill you in as he is a reseller :)
The CAD side of Dolphin I dont use as its a bit clunky and I have never bothered to learn it.
Hood
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Hey, Russ, thanks for that!
You are without a doubt in the avant-garde, Hood!
Thanks for the link!
Dan
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Dan, I've got one I can part with.
SPDT, 8 new relays.
Was thinking of taking some stuff to York for the guys to pick through but might not make it this year.
No reasonable offer refused. :)
You pay the shipping.
PM me if interested.
Regards,
Russ
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Dan,
here is pics of the board.
Standard DIN rail mount on the back.
Russ
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Thanks Russ.
Hood, probably for you: in the first photo, the header on the left looks like the 24VDC supply, and the one on the right looks like the control. What would the control be? Will it work with 5V?
Dan
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Dan
Not 100% sure what you are meaning but if I am understanding, in the top pic the ++-- is where you connect the 24v supply and 1 to 8 is for each relay and you put the 24v+ from your control. 5v would not work as the relays are 24v coil, if you put relays with 5V coils and joined the 0v of the 5v supply and the 0v of the 24v supply then it would probably work. The LED signifying the activation of the relay would be dull though.
Hood
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Hood,
Yes, you understood exactly what I was asking :) So both the supply and control are 24V. Thanks.
Dan
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Yes.
You could always convert over to 24v ;)
Hood
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LOL... I was trying to keep this conversion as simple as I could, but somehow I keep adding more "features" to it, and now you're suggesting throwing in a PLC as well... no thanks ;)
Dan
P.S.
Sorry, forgot that simple for you means using a PLC in the first place :D
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Yes PLC is good but 24v BOBs and differential I/O BOB for ESS would make it 24v ;D
Hood
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Looks like the Bridgeport may never be fully finished ;D
I have been offered a Chiron FZ12 without control/motors and I am going to look it over this weekend. If I get it I will need to get rid f my Student lathe and the Bridgeport to make room. I will likely need the drives and motors off of the Bridgeport and also the PLC etc so will strip out all the electrics.
Not sure what I will do, I could possibly sell it just for scrap or try and sell it as a bare machine for retrofit or I suppose I could put the steppers back on and sell it as a runner. Will see what happens at the weekend then I will decide which way to go after that but its looking like it will be unfinished ;D
Hood