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Mach Discussion => General Mach Discussion => Topic started by: controlfreq on January 07, 2010, 10:54:22 PM

Title: Driver Test Not What Expected
Post by: controlfreq on January 07, 2010, 10:54:22 PM
I've tried this install and test on two machines now. The test reults just seem way to low compared to what I've seen others machines on this forum doing. Mach3 is the latest version just downloaded last week.:

#1 HP Desktop, P4 3GHz Processor, 2GB Ram, Integrated graphics, XP home. Was unable to convert install to the standard PC. Removed most all start up services, except the ones that looked crucial for basic function. No startup programs or other programs installed. Performed all other optimizations. Set the PP in the bios to ECP, and EPP separately to confirm test.

25KHz
16500 Pulses Per Second
57uS short
63uS long
Graph fairly steady...Looks good

#2 Abit BH7 mobo, P4 1.8GHz, 1GB Ram, ATI 9700 128MB Memory (AGP) Graphics Card. XP Pro configured as Standard PC, APIC off in BIOS, Removed most all start up services, except the ones that looked crucial for basic function. No startup programs or other programs installed. All other optimization steps completed.

25KHZ
12500 Pulses Per Second
79uS Short
85uS Long
Majority of graph is above the max scale of 80uS

on both test the APIC constant is reported as 8100, and the APIC light is green??? I will be using this to control 3 stepper motors on a router table.

I would have expected that the PPS would have been over 35K or so, based on what I've seen other machines report on here. I'm ready to dive in, so I'm all ears.
Title: Re: Driver Test Not What Expected
Post by: controlfreq on January 08, 2010, 01:21:56 AM
Update -
I did the OriginalDriver.bat change as mentioned here ( http://www.machsupport.com/forum/index.php/topic,13634.msg89890.html#msg89890 ). This worked on the #2 machine that has the XP Pro with the APIC disabled; however as I feared, it caused the #1 HP machine still using APIC to freeze the driver test application.

Also, is this file swap procedure only changing the way in which the speeds are reported/calculated, or is it changing some feature which allows the test to run at a higher rate?

I'll have to get my stepper motors resolution figured out, and ball screw pitch to see what frequency I'll have to run to get the speed the system is capable of. Does the smooth stepper require USB2.0 or will 1.1 work?

Thank you,
Title: Re: Driver Test Not What Expected
Post by: Hood on January 08, 2010, 03:18:07 AM
What version of Mach? You say the latest but say last week, there have been recent driver issues due to an update that was done for threading and it seems to have introduced some weird problems for a few. Try Rev 034 as that is the latest, if not try going back to 029 or so.

Hood
Title: Re: Driver Test Not What Expected
Post by: controlfreq on January 08, 2010, 03:31:32 AM
Version 3.042.033 Mach3. I see there were some updates in the last few days. I'll try giving 3.042.035 a try. especially since my #1 PC is a 3.0 GHz processor.

Thank you,
Title: Re: Driver Test Not What Expected
Post by: controlfreq on January 08, 2010, 04:05:39 AM
did an un-install of Mach3, re-booted the system, then a re-install with the new version (3.042.035). re-booted the system again. the driver test worked awesome....was able to test and read up to 100KHz; however, mach3 will not open. The error message returns art code 1, and art code 3026 (I believe). I'll try and attach the dump file here.

happy to see the test worked on that machine. But, I want to load the latest on my other machine, but I'm concerned if it will lock it up like it did this one.

This test was done with the NON-Disabled APIC machine.....If I load it on the #2 machine with APIC disabled, should I run the SpecialDriver.Bat file?

Thank you,
Title: Re: Driver Test Not What Expected
Post by: Hood on January 08, 2010, 06:38:11 AM
I will mention this to Art but probably best for the time being to go back to an earlier version unless you specifically need something in these later versions.
Hood
Title: Re: Driver Test Not What Expected
Post by: controlfreq on January 08, 2010, 01:02:14 PM
Ok, I will try. Oddly enough in the archives I see a Vers. 3.043.000 but the modified date is 12/24/2008. I also don't see a version 3.042.034??? I will try to load .033 back on when I get the chance.....I was just so happy with the driver test results of .035. Of course, driver test results don't make a machine run  :o

Do you think it was a problem with the un-install?

Thanks hood.
Title: Re: Driver Test Not What Expected
Post by: ger21 on January 08, 2010, 02:20:02 PM
When you uninstall, manually remove the driver from the device manager.
Title: Re: Driver Test Not What Expected
Post by: Hood on January 08, 2010, 05:38:29 PM
Art found an issue with the build of 035, try the 034 version again as I am not sure if that has been updated or whether the next one will be.
Oh and download it again rather than just try the version you have already downloaded.
Hood
Title: Re: Driver Test Not What Expected
Post by: Chip on January 08, 2010, 05:53:35 PM
Hi, Hood

It's the 515 drive, So it hasn't been updated, Do you have the latest one and could you post it. ?
Think it's 517.

Chip
Title: Re: Driver Test Not What Expected
Post by: Hood on January 08, 2010, 05:55:32 PM
afraid not, I dont use the PP so no need for the driver.
Hood
Title: Re: Driver Test Not What Expected
Post by: ART on January 08, 2010, 07:07:51 PM
Hi Guys:

 First, enevr run the specialdriver.bat unless the computer is simply rebooting when attempting to run MAch3. All the special driver does is turn off Apic usage, tring to use a
non available apic will reboot the system.

   It sounds like the .035 version driver fixes this problem of low frequency for you, so Id wait for Brians re-release of it. It shoudl be within a day or so I suspect.
Let me know if theres any trouble when .036 is released...with driver 517

thx,
Art
Title: Re: Driver Test Not What Expected
Post by: controlfreq on January 08, 2010, 08:16:24 PM
Thanks guys,

I uninstalled the 035, did a manual un-install of the driver through device manager. Re-booted the system then installed 033 again. re-booted the system and Mach3 will run....but the driver test does not work again (as expected).

I don't see a copy of 034 on the FTP site, nor do I see it elsewhere; but, I think I will wait a couple of days for 036 to release anyway. I'm in a bit of a hurry, but this is on a new-to-me startup, so I have lots of items to work on. These stepper motors have never been turned nor have the stepper drives been used.....should be fun.

Is there a chance that 035 would run on my machine that has APIC disabled, if I run the appropriate driver, via the .bat? to clarify the question, is Mach3.noapic used on machines configured as Standard Computer with the APIC disabled?

Thank you,
Title: Re: Driver Test Not What Expected
Post by: Greolt on January 08, 2010, 09:31:39 PM
035 appeared on the download page with driver 516, but it had a problem throwing up an error on boot,  and was pulled from the download page.

It has now reappeared with driver 517 and it works for me. 

It has fixed the wandering pulse speed issue that appeared in 034, for me at least.

Greg
Title: Re: Driver Test Not What Expected
Post by: controlfreq on January 08, 2010, 10:00:46 PM
Are revisions really being made without indexing the minor Rev. number.....ie two releases of 3.042.035 with different driver packages etc.......and I don't see any reflection of this modification in the change log?

Just curious before I chase my tail with install/uninstall.

My last download of 035 was really early this morning (depending on time zone), but I can give it another try.

Thank you,
Title: Re: Driver Test Not What Expected
Post by: Greolt on January 08, 2010, 10:05:27 PM
Here is a copy of a post that Brian made on the Yahoo group a couple of hours ago,

Yeah.. I had put it up and I was about to test it.. and before I could I
had people telling me that it was not working... Turns out it was a bad
build of Mach3 O well.. it is back n the web and should be good to go now!
Thanks
Brian

Greg
Title: Re: Driver Test Not What Expected
Post by: controlfreq on January 08, 2010, 11:02:04 PM
Well, Kudos so far....downloaded the latest .035 and it runs the driver test as expected.....and Mach3 launches. That's a great start. I look forward to moving forward with this build.

So, the big question.....does the fixes to the driver test have any bearing on the performance of the Mach3 program. I know there is much behind the scenes, but were the problems with the driver program also affecting the Mach3 performance? I would love a 30 second explanation of the changes that cause the driver test to more accurately reflect the testing frequency, and what bearing that code has on the performance of Mach3, given that the diagnostic screen of Mach3 always displayed the accurate PPS configured.

Thanks for all the work.
Title: Re: Driver Test Not What Expected
Post by: ART on January 09, 2010, 12:23:40 AM
Hi:

 The driver wont impact performance of MAch3 other than making feedrates and frequency more accurate. Performance MAY be enhanced by other fixes Brian may have done..
But in general, you shouldnt see any real change, unless previosu versions wouldnt lock in properly.

  As to the Apic, doesnt matter if your in apic mode or standard mode , most cpus still use the apic driver. Only machines that reboot on run usually require the non-apic driver. Non-apic meaning the motherbaord has no apic in the cpu chip.. most now do.


Art
Title: Re: Driver Test Not What Expected
Post by: controlfreq on January 09, 2010, 02:26:58 AM
I installed the latest .035 version on both machines. One the #1 machine, everything is running fine. On the #2 machine, I ran the Special Driver script as that PC is configured as a Standard Computer, and in the BIOS the APIC is disabled. There are two things that causes the driver test application to freeze, and occasionally cause a re-boot.
1. setting the frequency at 100KHz
2. changing the frequency setting while the application is taking control

Next while running Mach3 and monitoring the frequency on the diagnostics screen, the frequency will sometimes go into single digits. For example, while configured for 25KHz, it will display 2, 48, 24950, 1, 88, 24337, etc.....

Odd. I'll be doing some testing this weekend, so we'll see how it works with the steppers.

Is there really a .036 nearing release, as previously referenced?

Thank you again....
Title: Re: Driver Test Not What Expected
Post by: ART on January 09, 2010, 10:17:25 AM
Hi:

 No, the second .035 is the final release number. SO what you have should work.

( I still woulnt use the special driver unless the machien reboots with the original one..)

Art
Title: Re: Driver Test Not What Expected
Post by: larry7gp on May 08, 2012, 09:45:45 AM
When you uninstall, manually remove the driver from the device manager.

I think I did my usual "install it and see if it works" thing and am fairly certain that I didn't reboot when it warned to. Then, when I read the install doc, I found that. (sigh)  Now, _what_ file do I manually remove? All I see in the docs are " manually remove 'the driver' ".  I'm using a SmoothStepper on a 64-bit machine, not a parallel port.
Title: Re: Driver Test Not What Expected
Post by: Hood on May 08, 2012, 11:01:43 AM
If it is a fairly recent version of Mach that you installed then it would sense whether the driver had previously been installed and would not reboot, if it was the first time then it would have rebooted itself.
Also worth mentioning, if you are using the Smoothstepper you do not need the driver installed as it communicates to Mach via a plugin, you only need the driver if you are controlling your machine via the parallel port.
Hood
Title: Re: Driver Test Not What Expected
Post by: larry7gp on May 08, 2012, 11:19:39 AM
If it is a fairly recent version of Mach that you installed then it would sense whether the driver had previously been installed and would not reboot, if it was the first time then it would have rebooted itself.
Also worth mentioning, if you are using the Smoothstepper you do not need the driver installed as it communicates to Mach via a plugin, you only need the driver if you are controlling your machine via the parallel port.
Hood

It's version R3.043.022.  I'm having problems getting set up.  When I load the XML file, it shows all pins and ports as zero.  I thought maybe it was due to the lack of the reboot.  I'll be finished with my CNC router build (hopefully) on Friday and still can't get the bloody software set up.  All my hair is now gone, pulled out in frustration.  I have a green light on the Gecko G540, green and blue lights on the SmoothStepper, and a flashing red indicating comm on the SmoothStepper, but can't figure out how to get it actually talking.
Title: Re: Driver Test Not What Expected
Post by: Hood on May 08, 2012, 11:24:15 AM
You need to set the ports and pins yourself, to suit your machine, unless you have got a xml from someone that has the same machine/setup as you.
Hood
Title: Re: Driver Test Not What Expected
Post by: larry7gp on May 08, 2012, 11:38:26 AM
You need to set the ports and pins yourself, to suit your machine, unless you have got a xml from someone that has the same machine/setup as you.
Hood
I set it up according to the Gecko file, 540BVFD.XML, but when it comes up in Mach, all the inputs and outputs are zeroed.
Title: Re: Driver Test Not What Expected
Post by: Hood on May 08, 2012, 11:52:13 AM
Sounds like you are opening the wrong profile, if you loaded a xml you need to load the profile with that name. So if the xml you placed in your Mach folder was called 540BVFD.XML you will need to open the profile called 540BVFD
To do that use the Mach3 Loader and choose it from the list.
Hood
Title: Re: Driver Test Not What Expected
Post by: larry7gp on May 08, 2012, 11:54:38 AM
Sounds like you are opening the wrong profile, if you loaded a xml you need to load the profile with that name. So if the xml you placed in your Mach folder was called 540BVFD.XML you will need to open the profile called 540BVFD
To do that use the Mach3 Loader and choose it from the list.
Hood

That is precisely what I did, yet the Ports and Pins list remains empty/zeroed when I look.
Title: Re: Driver Test Not What Expected
Post by: Hood on May 08, 2012, 12:18:55 PM
Can you attach the xml, also have a look on the diagnostics page and see what the frequency DRO says.
Hood
Title: Re: Driver Test Not What Expected
Post by: larry7gp on May 08, 2012, 01:24:27 PM
Quote
Can you attach the xml, also have a look on the diagnostics page and see what the frequency DRO says.
Hood

The only freq I see on the diag page is Pulse Frequency which shows "external."
Attached are the original copy and saved, as modified by Mach.
I'm having a heck of a time uploading those bleeping files.  It tells me that it already has a file with that name
so I changed it to saved540.xml and orig540.xml, then retry, but it won't upload. (I love forum software...)
OK, trying LJsaved540.xml and LJorig540.xml
Title: Re: Driver Test Not What Expected
Post by: Hood on May 08, 2012, 02:48:30 PM
Ok that is fine for the frequency as I was wanting to know if you had selected the external controller and you have.
Place this xml in the Mach3 folder and using the laoder open it and see how you get on. I have not changed any ports or pins from that of the original one so not sure if they are correct or not but see how you go.
Hood
Title: Re: Driver Test Not What Expected
Post by: larry7gp on May 08, 2012, 03:08:35 PM
Quote
Ok that is fine for the frequency as I was wanting to know if you had selected the external controller and you have.
Place this xml in the Mach3 folder and using the laoder open it and see how you get on. I have not changed any ports or pins from that of the original one so not sure if they are correct or not but see how you go.
Hood

OK, I cloned it and used Mach Loader.  Initial error was for different s/n, OK.  Now it gives me  "Spindle-axis Step Port = 0. Valid values are 1 and 2."
"Spindle-axis Dir Port = 0. Valid pin values are 1,23,4,5,6,7,8,9,14,16, and 17" errors.

X,Y,Z,A are step port 1 dir port 1 with 2-9 pins on the axes, and spindle enabled with step pin 14, others zero.
X,Y,Z,A homes are port 1, 10-13, respectively.
EStop is port 1 pin 15.
Outputs port 1 pin 17, port 1 pin 1.
Charge pump port 1 pin 16.

I applied those and it gives me the original spindle errors.  I believe I'm closer to running, though!  What should the inputs be for a relay-based router
as the spindle?  It's not set up yet, physically.

Thanks much for the help, by the way, Hood!
Title: Re: Driver Test Not What Expected
Post by: Hood on May 08, 2012, 03:19:45 PM
Not sure  why you are cloning it, there is no need to, just open whichever profile you wish to use and set up the ports and pins to what you want and then close, next time you open it will, or at least should, be as you had previously set it up.

Spindle I dont know, never used the G540 but if that is the correct settings then you can tell the SmoothStepper to ignore port and pin errors, do that from Plugin Control menu the SS Config, you should see a box to tick.
Hood
Title: Re: Driver Test Not What Expected
Post by: larry7gp on May 08, 2012, 03:27:15 PM
Not sure  why you are cloning it, there is no need to, just open whichever profile you wish to use and set up the ports and pins to what you want and then close, next time you open it will, or at least should, be as you had previously set it up.

Spindle I dont know, never used the G540 but if that is the correct settings then you can tell the SmoothStepper to ignore port and pin errors, do that from Plugin Control menu the SS Config, you should see a box to tick.
Hood

I had cloned it to save the original file intact.  And it was good I had, because before, it had been eating my xml files.   While you were writing the reply, I entered port 2 for the spindle and it saved without error!   I went to the MDI and clicked the REF ALL HOME button and the Z axis started turning at 1.5rps.  I got movement for the first time!

Is there a little G-code test floating around here for testing the axes?  And will I need limit and home switches hooked up to test?
Title: Re: Driver Test Not What Expected
Post by: Hood on May 08, 2012, 03:58:51 PM
You dont need limit switches but your machine will be safer if you do, especially with you being new. Home switches are a good thing to have as it allows you to set a work offset and then go back to it another time if you restart Mach.
Use one of the wizards to create code, circular pocket wizard might be a good one to try.
Hood
Title: Re: Driver Test Not What Expected
Post by: Overloaded on May 08, 2012, 05:33:41 PM
These demos might be handy for testing as well.
http://www.machsupport.com/forum/index.php/topic,18345.0.html
Russ