Machsupport Forum
Mach Discussion => General Mach Discussion => Topic started by: Peter Granger on October 01, 2024, 06:42:48 PM
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Hello,
I am using Vetric VCarve pro software. I purchased a 4 x 8 ATC CNC machine from China. It is From Quick CNCrouter. My machine is the P408 (It is also called K1325ATC). I have a stand alone computer with Mach3. I am trying to figure out the proper Post Processor. Unfortunately the support is in China and they speak Mandrin. I have asked what processor they would like me to use but so far I haven't had much luck. I have tried several ones from Vetric but none seem to work. The ones that I have tried start to work and then the machine stops and I get this error message. Error!Buffer Write 31 times attempted. Terminating Usb..I am thinking I need the proper processor to start. What ideas do you have?
Cheers
Peter
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Hi Peter,
Sorry to hear of your troubles. I don't think the Post Processor is the issue. In Vcarve pro however if you select a metric post processor it should work. the error you are getting seems more like a Motion controller issue. Is there a Plugin that mach3 uses to talk to the motion controller? Do you have a licensed copy of Mach3? I'm not saying your copy is, but being from China it is likely that it is a cracked copy.
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Thanks for answering Charlie. I reached out to Vetric and they recommended a Processsor that apears to be working. The machine came with Mach3 that appears to be licenced. it's not in my name but i am assuming it is in the name of someone where I purchased the machine from. Right now I am trying to set up the tools. The machine has an eight slot ATC with a tool lenght probe. I am struggling abit on how to set up the tools properly. I can command the machine to probe the tool in the T8 config menu. The same menu that was set up to tell the machine where the tools are in the ATC. If I go into the Tool Table menu I can name the tool and put in the diameter. I just need to figure out how to check the tool lenght and keep it saved in Mach3. Any ideas? I have tried to find videos on line but they only seem to show how to make the macros.
Cheers
Peter
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Hi Charlie,
I thought I had things worked out with the proper processor. I did a simple circle and the program seemed to work properly. I tried to do a star that has more line codes. The tools needed to be changed and the machine did that fine. It then started working on the file and before it could start the machine stopped and the buffer error came up. -Error!Buffer Write 31 times attempted. Terminating Usb.. I thought i had it fixed but i have not. I think i figured out the tool length probe. I will go through the steps in another post to you.
Cheers
Peter
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I want to make sure that I am using the tool length probe on my machine properly.
1. I go into the tool table under config.
2. I pick the tool number put in the tool name, Diameter of the tool, put a nominal number for length. Save the values.
3. Under plugin control I go to XHC Ncpod Config.
4. I go to the XT8 button, and the T8 Config screen opens. That is where I can command the machine to change tools and where the setting is for the ATC.
5. I pick the tool that I want to probe. I hit the probe button and let the machine probe.
6. Once it has probed, I go to the Offsets screen. I press the Set Tool Offset button and the Z off set value changes. I save it and go onto the next tool.
I am to assume that if I don’t change the tool, I don’t have to re probe until things change. I also assume that there is no automatic way for this to happen. I think it is set properly but how do I check what the height of the probe sensor is to the table height?
Cheers
Peter
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Hi Peter,
It may be a good idea to check out this thread and if the name of your Mach3 licence appears there you will need to purchace a new license to ensure that Mach3 performs as it should (Mach3 has an inbuilt license checking which detects certain Pirate Licenses then deliberately misbehaves). https://www.machsupport.com/forum/index.php?topic=24331.0
You could also PM me the name on your license and I will check it against my list to verify that it is genuine.
Tweakie.
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Hi Peter,
Thanks for sending the PM.
Unfortunately you are using a well known Pirate License which will cause you problems with running Mach3 correctly. Before proceeding you should purchase and install a genuine Mach3 license which can be obtained from here; https://www.machsupport.com/licensing/
Whilst Mach4 is an option I don't think XHC provide a fully working plugin for their controllers to use all of the Mach4 features so switching to Mach4 may involve changing out your Motion controller for something more suitable.
Tweakie.
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Hello,
I am going to see if I can get a proper license from where I purchased my machine from (I am not holding my breath!). Am I able to put in a proper license and keep all of the settings that I have inputted so far? Are you fairly hopeful that this should fix my buffer problem and my machine should work properly?
Cheers
Peter
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Hi Peter,
You will only be able to purchase a genuine Mach3 licence from Artsoft/NFS or one of their authorised dealers (Good luck with trying to get a genuine license from a retailer that has already provided you with a Pirate copy).
Installing a genuine licence will enable you to keep all of your existing settings.
There are no gurantees because your buffer problem relates more to the XHC motion controller, all I can say is that you will never be able to sucessfully run Mach3 with the Pirate licence.
Tweakie.
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Hello,
I just purchased a proper license and installed it into Mach3. I went to run a fairly simple program and I came up with the same problem a buffer error. I was hoping getting a proper license would solve this problem but I guess its deeper than I Thought. Any ideas? I was hoping to send a screen shot but I can't paste it in this window. Not sure how to send a screen shot if you need it. This is the history in note book.
Tue - 18:06:16 ---Program Startup
Tue - 18:06:18 ---ReConfiguration Estop.
Tue - 18:06:28 ---Find No XHC Ethernet!
Tue - 18:06:31 ---EStop Button Pressed.
Tue - 18:06:52 ---HomeSwitch Triggered.
Tue - 18:08:28 ---3 = #46177-K SC COMPRESSION SPIRAL 1/4" DIA.x1/4" SHANK
Tue - 18:08:28 ---#46177-K SC COMPRESSION SPIRAL 1/4" DIA.x1/4" SHANK
Tue - 18:08:28 ---Toolpath:- star test
Tue - 18:08:36 ---Soft warning on Z max
Tue - 18:08:41 ---3 = #46177-K SC COMPRESSION SPIRAL 1/4" DIA.x1/4" SHANK
Tue - 18:08:41 ---#46177-K SC COMPRESSION SPIRAL 1/4" DIA.x1/4" SHANK
Tue - 18:08:49 ---Toolpath:- star test
Tue - 18:09:29 ---Error!Buffer Write 31 times attempted. Terminating Usb..
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Besides the propper license, you will have to reinstall Mach3 which you can download from official site. Throw away the version that you got from seller. Before copy your .ini and other files that you maybe have modified and copy them back to the appropriate folders after the reinstalation.
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Hello,
Thanks for getting back to me. I couldn't make the Mach3 that was supplied to work and I downloaded Mach3 from your site and installed there setting for the set up of my machine. Do you think that the bad license could have corupted your version of Mach 3? I am not sure exactly what file that would have been changed. would you know exactly which one would have been changed?
Cheers
Peter
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Mach that was supplied with your machine is a hacked version to be able to work with the supplied license.
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Hello,
I have been busy building my house and haven't had any time to get my CNC Machine working properly. I finally had some time today. This is where I am at. Unfortunately, I am getting the same result a buffer error and the machine stops. I downloaded a new version of Mach3. I have my own license that I purchased. I put all the settings in for my machine manually. I had to copy over the driver file for the Ethernet card (NcEther-8ts) from plug ins that was supplied with the machine I was asked with the install to set up the parallel port and when i said yes the driver couldn't be found (I don't think this is a problm?). I copied over the whole Macro file that was supplied with the machine. With these files the machine homes and moves properly from what I can see. I ran a simple circle program, and it worked until it started to cut the fake material (until I can get thinks to work properly I am cutting air as i don't want to wreck the machine or bits). I uninstalled the macro file an installed the one from Mach3 when i download a fresh copy. I now get error messages and the I can’t get the machine to move. I looked at the two different Macro files and there are 10 more files from where i received the machine from. I haven’t figured out which files they are. My thoughts are that one of these files is bad or there is a problem with the machine. Do you have any ideas?
Cheers
Peter
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Hello,
I spent some time looking at the macro files and I was able to firgure out which files are different or new. Is there someone that couls look at these files and let me know if they are good?
Cheers
Peter
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Hello,
It's me again. I have been spending some more time with the machine. I am able to get the machine to work with just the dowloaded software from Mach 3. I couldn't get it to change tools but I was able to load a simple program to cut a circle. It starts to work but it stops and the same Buffer error message comes up. I am now thinking that it could be the controller that the machine came with from China. It is a MACH3 Ethernet Motion Control Card | MKX-ET. What are some of your thoughts?
Cheers
Peter
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Hi Peter,
For what it is worth, my thoughts...
The MKX-ET is a reasonably well made controller but it suffers the problem that WiXhc no longer provide support for this product. There may be issues with the supplied Mach3 plugin (which was developed using a very old version of Mach3 running under WindowsXP) and it will never be fixed so, as far as the developers are concerned, you are on your own.
The EU or USA made controllers (such as those from CNC Drive or Warp9, etc.) do have manufacturers support so developer's assistance may available for sorting out any problems you may encounter. That said, Mach3 is an obsolescent product and all the current motion controller developers are, I think, concentrating on Mach4 so their latest Mach3 plugins will work well with the last version of Mach3 but any future bug-fixes are extremely unlikely.
Food for thought ?.
Tweakie.
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Thanks for your thoughts. I'm not sure what to do. I have been trying to figure this out for months on and off. I have purchased a Mach3 license that I really don't want to waste. If i was to goto Mach4 what controller would I need? How difficult do you think it would be to install? To get to the current problem that I have, with all of the proper Mach3 installation and proper license, do you think the controller is the problem?
Cheers
Peter
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Hi Peter,
It is perhaps impossible to say what is best for you as we all seem to use our CNC machines differently but I suggest that you seriously consider replacing the XiXhc motion controller with one that supports both Mach3 and Mach4 as this will solve your current buffer problem with Mach3 and provide you with more scope for the future. If it was not for the demise of the Parallel Port I would still be using Mach3 but I need Raster Scan capability for laser use.
Although I have 5 different (EU / USA manufactured) motion controllers, each of which I have trialled over the years, for my particular applications the CNC Drive AXBB-E and UC400ETH motion controllers have turned out to be the best. That said, they may not be the best for everyone so you need to do your research but avoid any that are made in China.
Hope this helps,
Tweakie.
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Thank-you. This helps. Since I didn't really use the Mach3 license, do you think that there would be any way to put that cost towards a Mach4 license?
Cheers
Peter
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Unfortunately there are no discount deals on changing from a Mach3 license to a Mach4 license.
Something you could possibly consider, which is perhaps the cheapest option, is spending 88 Euros on a UC100 motion controller and continue using Mach3. https://www.shop.cncdrive.com/index.php?categoryID=114
In retrospect my suggestion was perhaps not such a smart idea - CNC Drive are currently not updating their Mach3 or Mach4 plugins to correct known bugs / limitations.
Tweakie.
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Hello,
I was reaching out to Dash x for one of their contollers (the smooth stepper) and I talked to Mike and explained what was happening. He thought that it might be electrical interference. I turned the spindle off while running the program and it ran fine. Then I had a little bit of time and this is what I came up with. I tried a shielded ethernet cable and it didn’t seem to make much of a difference. I started running ground wires in the machine (through the gantry). Didn’t seem to make any difference. When I first had success, I had a ground wire from the top of the spindle to the ground in the machine going out to the wall. I tried this again and it didn’t seem to help this time. I noticed that when the spindle came up to 18000 RPM it would sound like it was chattering or wasn’t running smooth. I dialed back the RPM and it would work. I slowly came to 17000 and it seemed to work for the simple program that I am testing with. Then it didn’t. when I get it back to 16000 RPM it seems to work most of the time. I have had it several times that it wouldn’t finish the last two lines of GCode an error came up and I had to restart. I think that the problem has something to do with the spindle. Whether it is the spindle it’s self or the EMI (electrical magnetic interference) from the spindle. Not sure if you have come across this before? Your thoughts?
Cheers
Peter
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Save screenshot as jpg and attach file
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This time I had the spindle at 17000 RPM and it quit once it tried to start moving the gantry. I am cutting a simple circle in the air as I don't want to break any bits. The spindle is rated for 18000 RPM. I sent you the history as i can't send you the individual errors.I also have a video but I am not sure how to send it to you.
Cheers
Peter
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Hello,
This has been an epic jouney with my CNC machine from China. At first it looked like it was a software issue with a bad or copied license for Mach3. I went in that direction and still wasn't able to make things work. One of the people that I reched out to thought it might be a problem with the spindle back feeding EMF. That led me into the right area. Turns out the the setting for the spindle weren't right and it was drawing more power that the controller was out putting. I have solved that problem. I think I have my machine set up and working properly. The problem that I have now I think is the way I set up Mach3. I am trying to surface my spoil board. I made a simple program in Vcarve. I have reviewed the Gcode (I had someone else look at too). I set Z zero. I raise the spindle and start the program. The first thing that happens is the dust boot comes down and then the spindle comes down and bottoms out on the spoil board to make an impression. It comes up and starts the rest of the program but now is above the material. I think that Mach3 thinks that the spindle is lower than it is because it bottomed out. I set the safe zero at 40 and when the spindle is moving it should be a lot higher than it is. It is only slightly higher than the material. When I stop the program I can use my computer to move X and Y but I can't move Z until I restart everything. I'm sure it is a setting or a little more. any ideas? Thanks in advance!
Cheers
Peter
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If you attach your surfacing GCode file (it needs to have a unique name) I will run it and see if I get the same problem.
Tweakie.
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Hi Tweekie,
Here is the G Code. Please let me know what you think. Thanks for your help.
Cheers
Peter
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If you turn on single step you can run the program one line at a time by pressing start, your code looks line it first Z move is to 50.8mm using height offset 8. At this point you can check the position of the tool over the work as the spindle is not running.
It looks like the code is programmed from the work top face so did you touch the tool on the board and zero out the Z axis?
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Hello,
Thanks for getting back to me. I did zero the tool to the top of the board. I need to flatten the Spoil Board. Once I have done that I plan to use the Board as zero. It's weird. I tried it again with Z zero set about 70mm above the spoil board to see what happens. Not sure why but the dust hood comes down and the G code is starting. The machine was at home all and was next to the board and the spindle came down and stoped at the bed which is aprox 100mm below the zero I had set. I am just about to watch a video on soft limits to see if there is anything there to help. I think it might be a setting in Mach3 that is wrong or I missed. Maybe its normal but if I move the gantry to where it would be machine home or past by mistake. I have to restart both the machine and the software to get things to move. not sure if that is the way the program works.
Cheers
Peter
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Hi Peter,
Your GCode file runs just fine here.
After you have zeroed the Z axis at the spoil board level then at program run the first Z axis movement should be to +50.8mm above the spoil board. As you have said the first Z axis movement is downwards then, as you suspect, something in Mach3 is set wrong.
With the Z axis at a safe height zero the Z axis DRO and using the MDI screen type Z10 and press return. The Z axis should rise by 10mm and the Z axis DRO should show +10.0000. Does this happen ?
Tweakie.
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Hello,
I did what you asked me to. The spindle when up what I assume was 10mm and the DRO showed +10.0000.
Cheers
Peter
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Hi Peter,
OK, so your Z axis is moving in the correct direction.
As you are zeroing your Z axis at the point that the tool touches the spoil board surface then, in my opinion, you do not need to be applying the G43 tool length offset for your surfacing operation.
Just as a test try deleting the H8 in line N140, so it reads N140G00G43Z50.800. Does this make any difference ?
Tweakie.
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Thanks. I will try that in the morning. I am asuming that you are in a different time zone? As we seem to be doing morning / night conversations. I am on the west coast of Canada. Where are you?
Cheers
Peter
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Hi Peter,
I am in London UK.
(Obviously Mach has tremendous versatility in its GCode handling but programming in Absolute mode (G90) and using Tool Length Offsets (G43) requires quite a bit of knowledge. As a result I always prefer to program in Incremental mode (G91) and only use G43H# on one particular milling machine. I like to keep everything as simple as possible.)
Tweakie.
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Hi Tweakie,
Thanks. I will be honest that last post is a little above my head. I have been doing CNC work for a while, but I had a much smaller machine and used open-source software that worked quite well. I decided to get a bigger machine to make cabinets on. The machine has an ATC and a tool length probe which I need to figure out. I am slowly getting there but the learning curve has been huge. I really appreciate your help. I will try what you suggested. If that works, how do I incorporate the tool length probe into my programs. I am slowly figuring things out, but I am sure I will have more questions going forward.
Cheers
Peter
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Hi Peter,
Setting up the Mach3 coordinate system is relatively easy but there is much to learn and certainly more than I could explain here. This tutorial video listed as Coordinate Systems and Homing in Mach3 is probably a good place to start; https://www.machsupport.com/help-learning/videos-tutorials/ also the Mach2 manual has details along with other documentation published by Artsoft. You will need plenty of time to digest it all but you will get there I am sure.
Hope this helps.
Tweakie.
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Hello,
I took out the code H8 and ran the program.It still tried to go through the spoil board or past zero that I set. If anything changed the tool didn't make as deep of an imprint as before. I ran the whole program and watched it. it did surface some small parts of the spoil board. They must have been higher. One thing that I did notice, was that the spindle was supposed to go up to 50.800. It did not. It stayed where it was I think. It looks like it. I just thought of this now I did not pay attention to what the DRO was showing. I can re run the program and watch this if you think this would be helpfull. I am also going to watch some of the mach3 videos. Thanks again for your help.
Cheers
Peter
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I was watching the video that you recomended. This is the screen shot of my current settings. It is a little different than the video. I tried to screen shot it but I couldn't get to show here or as an attachment.
On Motor home soft limit screen X Reversed green check, Soft max 1300.00, soft min -1.00, Home Neg red X
Y Reversed green check, soft max 2940.00, soft min -2.00, Home Neg red X
Z Reversed Green check, soft max 1.0, soft min -285.00, Home Neg green check.
I am pretty sure the rest of those setting are how the software comes.
Not sure if this helps.
Thanks Again!
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One thing that I did notice, was that the spindle was supposed to go up to 50.800. It did not. It stayed where it was I think. It looks like it. I just thought of this now I did not pay attention to what the DRO was showing. I can re run the program and watch this if you think this would be helpfull.
Hi Peter,
I think it would be helpful if you run this again.
With the H8 removed (as mentioned earlier) and the Z axis zeroed - when you run the Gcode file your Z axis should initially rise by 50.8mm and the DRO should show this.
It is possible that your Z axis could be stalling and loosing steps either due to the Velocity / Acceleration being set too high in Motor Tuning or tightness / binding in the mechanicals or slippage in the drive coupling, etc.
Tweakie.
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Hi Peter,
I just noticed something odd which I don't fully understand...
If, on the main screen, you click the To Go button it starts flashing. If you then run your Gcode file it behaves in a strange manner with regard to the Z axis movement. Clicking on this button a second time stops it flashing.
The To Go button is only intended to display (on the DRO's) the distance to go for the current movement but it is doing more than this.
Please check that you do not have the To Go button flashing when you run your Gcode file.
Tweakie.
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Hello,
I re ran the program and watched the DRO. I homed the machine. I moved X and Y to the corner of the spoil board and zeroed it. I then moved X to 135 and Y to 162. They seem to work fine. I brought Z to the top of the spoilboard and zeroed it. I then moved it up to +60. I started the program with H8 removed. The dust hood came down and the the spindle lowered into the spoil board to make a mark. It came up slightly and moved to X and Y zero. When the spindle moved it might have been at Z +1. The DRO for Z showed +50.8. I ran the whole program and the DRO came to -.500. If the spindle moved it was only slightly. It should have tried to go through the table. I checked the Machine Cord's and Z was at -423.5975. I don't even have that much travel on the Z axis. The motor home/soft limits for Z are soft max 1.0 (should that be zero?) and soft min is at -285. When to program finished it came back to zero. the DRO read +50.8 but the spindle didn't raise. The Machine Cord's read +372.2975. I opened the cabinet and took a look. The servo drive for Z had an error 20. I retested again and as soon as the spindle bottoms ot on the spoil board the error came back. It must know that the spindle didn't travel properly. I brought out my dial guage to confirm the travel of Z. My dial guage is in thousands of an inch, it doesnt have a huge travel, I couldn't get perfectly straight either. I moved the spindle 10mm and came up with 398 thousand of an inch. Google said the it should be 393.7. I think that is prety close and I moved Z several times up and down and came up with the same results. I still think it is a Mach3 setting that needs to be inputted or I put one in wrong. What do you think? Is there a way I can send you pioctures of the settings if you think that would be helpful. Thanks again!
Cheers
Peter
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Hi Peter,
If you attach the <your profile>.xml file (typically Mach3Mill.xml) wich is located in your Mach3 folder I can set my machine to your setup and see if I can find any fault with your Mach3 settings.
You will need to rename the <your profile>.xml file to a unique name in order to attatch it to your posting.
Which Motion Controller are you using & is it connected USB or Ethernet to your PC. ?
Tweakie.
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I hope this works. I have had some challenges with edge. I connect with ethernet. I was told to turn off the internet so I have when I am running Mach 3. Please let me know if this works. I won't get back to you until tomorrow.
Cheers
Peter
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Hi Peter,
Just a quick check of your Mach3 settings reveal many errors.
For example you are using Port 1, Pins 2 to 9 for Motor Outputs & they cannot be used for Input Signals. They also cannot be used again for Output Signals.
If you click the Operator tab / Check Config. this will detail some, but not all, of the errors in your Mach3 setup. You may also have errors in your MKX-ET setup which you will need to check.
I think that the best advice that I can give you at this stage is to read through the Mach3 manual which details just how to set-up Mach3 for optimum performance.
https://www.machsupport.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/02/Mach3Mill_Install_Config.pdf
Tweakie.
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Hello,
I was finally able to surface my spoil board! A very long time coming. I have read a bunch of the manual but still have some more to read. If you have time please look at the xml file and see what you think. I still have some fine tuning to do. A few questions with the set up. I watched the Art Soft video on Trouble shooting and was able to get lots of information from it. One of the things that was said was that on the Diagnostics page that there shouldn't be any lights on the Input signal and current state box. Input 2 was on and I turned on active low and it went out. I did the same for Input 3 and it went out. I just rechecked it and it was on and turned off the active low and it went out. Not sure why this is. The digitize light is on but I don't see anywhere in the inputs to change anything. I also had to figure out the motor steps, which I did. I am not sure what to do about the acceleration and velocity. I did read that section but still am a little unsure what to set this at. I watched a few online video's and it seems to be set by sound? What are your thoughts on this? Thanks again for all of your help. I have a few more questions on tool changing and auto zero but I see that there are some video's from Art Soft about this and I will watch those first.
Cheers
Peter
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Hi Peter,
Great news that you have your machine working :) :) :)
Looking at your .xml, you still need to correct your Port & Pin allocations which are wrong otherwise Mach3 will get confused and you will have inaccurate results and problems in the future.
The Digitize light is controlled by the Input Signal Probe.
With regard to Motor Tuning, this is basically done by ‘trial and error’; Ideally Acceleration should be set to the highest value that works with 100% reliability even if it means reducing Velocity slightly.
CNC is a long road and I have been on it for more than 20 years now and still learn something new every day. Keep at it my friend.
Tweakie.
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Thanks again for your help. In all of the information I have received from Art Soft, the connection to the CNC machine is through printer ports. I am conected through eithernet. Where can I get information on how to properly set this up with Ports and Pins?
Cheers
Peter
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Thanks again for your help. In all of the information I have received from Art Soft, the connection to the CNC machine is through printer ports. I am conected through eithernet. Where can I get information on how to properly set this up with Ports and Pins?
Cheers
Peter
Yes indeed, you make a valid point, but we have to remember that the Mach3 manual was originally written when the Parallel Port was the norm.
Mach3 makes all it's trajectory calculations and planning based on the information wich you provide to it - irrespective of it being sent to the Motion Controller by Ethernet, USB or the Parallel Port. You do need to correct your Ports & Pins errors so that Operator / Check Config... gives a clean bill of health.
Hope this helps.
Tweakie.