Machsupport Forum
Mach Discussion => Mach Screens => Works in progress => Topic started by: DaOne on August 20, 2011, 11:22:22 PM
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As cool as everyones designs are for turn they still never quite fit what I was looking for. I have decided to go my own direction with something I have had in the works for quite some time. It has always been a dream of mine to create a full conversational interface with a professional control look and function. With this screen set not only will it offer a clean professional layout similar to a real control it will also allow you to build full programs right from the multiple "wizards" that are imbedded into the interface. You will have full control of each operation. You can view all operations as well as delete last op and save the program you created. Just about anything simple can be programmed right on the IPS system complete with multiple tooling. This is very similar to what Haas Automation offers on there tool room series lathes. The amount of time I have put into this I will be charging a small amount for it when its finished if anyone is interested. Here are a few a screen shots of new screen in action so you can get an idea of what I am talking about. The cycle screen is not finished yet. I would love to hear feedback of any kind.
Thanks,
Wes
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Nice work Wes... I like
The Control +- 10% override... I'd kind of like to have the option (text box) to a value I choose.
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Certainly a fresh approach to using using the wizards with improved graphics.
Have fun in your task.
RICH
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Are the checkboxes and radio buttons LED's with transparent buttons? That's how I did them in my 2010 Screenset.
That looks like a tremendous amount of work. :o
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Not sure how the thread repair will work but feel free to use the info in Threading onThe Lathe page 49 & 50 on how to pick up a thread.
RICH
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Nice work Wes... I like
The Control +- 10% override... I'd kind of like to have the option (text box) to a value I choose.
See the box to the right of each control? Thats editable. The "LED" indicator for the rapid rate will light up for each value if it matches the box to the right. Say its 50% it will highlight the 50% button but if its 51% none of them will be lit. You can press the button for a quick input or put your value in to the right. full customization of control.
Certainly a fresh approach to using using the wizards with improved graphics.
Have fun in your task.
Thanks Rich :)
Insert Quote
Are the checkboxes and radio buttons LED's with transparent buttons? That's how I did them in my 2010 Screenset.
That looks like a tremendous amount of work. Shocked
Yes the check boxes and radio buttons are "LEDs" with a transparent button over the text next to them. I was having issues with the LEDs showing the change if the transparent button was over small LEDs. I even tried a separate transparent button just for the LED and one for the text but it still screwed up half the time. Maybe you have some insite on that? Yes... tremendous amount of work don't even cover it. I even amaze myself how much time I have into this. :o I am sure its gonna be a hit with the lathe crowd.
Not sure how the thread repair will work but feel free to use the info in Threading onThe Lathe page 49 & 50 on how to pick up a thread.
Rich,
Thats exactly how it works. Same way as explained in your excellent write up on threading. It has a button you press when you have it set to the the tread with the index LED on. This sets it up. I haven't finished that one yet but in theory it should work. Gives people the ability to repair threads without using a whole lot of thought.
Does anyone have a list of canned cycles that work in Mach3? Preferably mill and lathe. Also if they are not standard Fanuc implementation if would be nice if there was any info on using them.
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Yes the check boxes and radio buttons are "LEDs" with a transparent button over the text next to them. I was having issues with the LEDs showing the change if the transparent button was over small LEDs. I even tried a separate transparent button just for the LED and one for the text but it still screwed up half the time. Maybe you have some insite on that?
I use a single transparent button over the checkbox and text. That way it mimics the way Windows actually works, as you can click the text next to a checkbox and it will change the box value in any windows app.
I use Screen4, and don't recall seeing any issues specific to small buttons. But I can tell you that the placement order is critical, and once placed, I don't touch them again. If I need to move something later, I'll actually make a copy of the original transparent button, then delete the original and use the new copy, to make sure it goes on top of the LED. I've seen instances where moving the LED and button seems to change their display order.
Yes... tremendous amount of work don't even cover it. I even amaze myself how much time I have into this.
Setting up all those "tabs" must be fun. >:D
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I did exactly that. You have a screen I can look at that has the check box working? Maybe its just my computer or a version issue? I tried may ways but it keeps screwing up so I gave up. I would love to be able to make it work like windows does but I need it to be reliable.
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list of canned cycles
Drillling machro for the lathe is in the tool box.
FWIW, RICH
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Well I have hit a wall on doing Dry Run mode. From my research there doesn't seem to be any sort of native dry run mode in Mach3. Maybe I am wrong about this? Anyways I went ahead and tried another method of turning on and off the engine. Works great to allow you to run the code without the machine moving however the DRO are all messed up when you turn it back on as it doesn't reset them back to how they were. OK, seemed like and easy fix. Just record the X and Z machine cord into a user DRO at the time of entering dryrun mode and take that value and put it back into the machine DROs when I leave it. Well I am unable to put the value back into the machine DROs using SetOEMDRO (83) and SetOEMDRO (85). Anyone have a suggestion? Dry run would be great for proving programs on the machine without running the drives and spindle.
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Offline button not do what you want?
Hood
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Hood,
It does turn off the machine and dry run like I want. The problem is when you take it out of the offline condition the machine cord DROs are not put back to where they were. There are off by whatever the program you ran in offline mode. The only way around this is to rehome the machine. You understand what I am talking about? Basically machine zero isnt machine zero after running something in offline mode. Got any ideas?
Thanks,
Wes
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Well DROs get set back with the SmoothStepper, not tried with the parallel port but I would imagine it to be the same
Hood
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SetOEMDRO (83) and SetOEMDRO (85) dont work at all for me. Is there another way to set these? Heard that you can push the encoder DRO to these but that one wont take a change either. ???
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Just tried with the parallel port and like you say it doesnt set the DROs to original machine coords, maybe you need to include a free SmoothStepper with every screen you sell ;D
You can only, as far as I know, set the machine coords by homing or by setting to zero by SetMachZero()
Hood
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I guess the only logical way to do dry run is to force it to go to machine zero before entering dry run mode so that I can reset zero or just re-home it. Try to add as many features to this as I can. Make it familiar for someone who has run the real deal. I hardly ever use dry run but I know people who rely on it.
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Never use it either, If I want to test out code I will offset the Z and run it for real cutting air as that is the only way you will see what its actually doing in my opinion.
You will have to be careful if you make part of the dry run a return t machine zero, better pop up a big warning box informing people this is about to happen ;)
Hood
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You will have to be careful if you make part of the dry run a return t machine zero, better pop up a big warning box informing people this is about to happen
Every single movement from a button or option gives you a warning describing the movement and the ability to say ok or cancel. Safety is priority with this project.
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OK, I am gonna need a couple of alpha testers on this soon to make sure all the bugs are worked out. I already have a few but want a few more. This is very roughed out at this point and may (most likely) have many bugs that need to be fixed. I am looking for people that are able to actually write or at least alter G-code by hand. They should have a lathe that is able to be homed with home switches. They should be familiar with the offset system on the lathe and able to setup and use multiple tools. Like I say it is at a early alpha stage at this point. Anyone that is part of testing on this will get a free final copy.
If you have interest in testing this and meat the qualifications listed above. Please send me an email at xgenmods@gmail.com with the specifications of the hardware you will be using such as but not limited to...
Mach version?
Have Touch screen?
Native screen resolution?
Have a MPG?
Lathe size?
How is your spindle speed controlled? (Mach or manual? Looking for people with VFD or servo controlled spindles)
Is your spindle capable of RPM feedback? (Index signal)
Spindle capable of forward / reverse?
QCTP?
Turret? If so number or tools?
Using carbide index-able tooling?
Do u use machine activated coolant? (If so flood or mist? Or both?)
Thanks,
Wes
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Here is the cycle screen. You will notice no more MPG feed% and no more button feed %. I have created a table that sets them to the correct values based on the step you select. This table is fully editable in the general settings screen. This really improves the jog buttons and smooths out the MPG drastically. The customization allows you to tune this to your preference and machine specs. This simplifies jogging down to a single touch. You can also switch on the fly between MPG and jog buttons. The "glow" on the buttons signifies they are selected. Everything is a single button operation. I would love to hear some feedback on the layout.
Thanks,
Wes
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Layout is clean and easy to read allowing for an easy transition from using the standard screen even though the buttons are changed which i like. Placement order looks right. MPG use / layout eliminates the flyout use. I will assume that the velociy is based on settings done in config. Would be nice to have buttons to zero the axis on the screen. Unfortunately no provision is made for using an A axis ( but i quess I am only one of the wierd ones that seem to desire it).
RICH
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Hi Wes. Excellent screens - you obviously have the patience of a saint. :)
Re: your earlier dry run question. How about in your "offline" button script, just do a "code G0" etc. to your stored positions (before you actually go back online obviously). I guess there's checks and stuff to do but I'll leave you to think about those ;)
BTW - the reason you can't write to MACHINE COORD DROs is because they're readonly - which makes sense.
Ian
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Unfortunately no provision is made for using an A axis ( but i quess I am only one of the wierd ones that seem to desire it).
RICH
I think you mean C axis (A rotates around X : B rotates around Y : C rotates around Z)
All Turning Center spindle orientations are using C axis that I have programmed.
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Re: your earlier dry run question. How about in your "offline" button script, just do a "code G0" etc. to your stored positions (before you actually go back online obviously). I guess there's checks and stuff to do but I'll leave you to think about those ;)
Kinda the same direction I am going. So many checks and balances to make sure everything works the way it should without problems. Lots of out of the box thinking going on with this.
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Unfortunately no provision is made for using an A axis ( but i quess I am only one of the wierd ones that seem to desire it).
I think you mean C axis (A rotates around X : B rotates around Y : C rotates around Z)
All Turning Center spindle orientations are using C axis that I have programmed.
On my Haas tool room lathe the "A" axis is a 4 position turret. Thats about the only place I have seen "A" on a lathe.
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Hi Wes,
As I said, this screen set is really cool and very useful.
If I may suggest something, I'd love to see the new Tool DRO, Brian implemented for Turn, being added to it. This OEM DRO 246 and it shows current tool and current offset in the format xxyy. Adding a 'T' in the formatting string makes it look even better: Txxyy.
Also, as I have a servo motor on my spindle and do (kind of) rigid tapping and indexing I would like to see a rotary axis DRO as suggested above by Rich.
Dan
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If I may suggest something, I'd love to see the new Tool DRO, Brian implemented for Turn, being added to it. This OEM DRO 246 and it shows current tool and current offset in the format xxyy. Adding a 'T' in the formatting string makes it look even better: Txxyy.
I have a good idea on this. How about I give you the option of what DRO to use for the"CURRENT TOOL" display at the top? Basically a radio button selection for the old style DRO or the new one on the settings screen tab.
Also, as I have a servo motor on my spindle and do (kind of) rigid tapping and indexing I would like to see a rotary axis DRO as suggested above by Rich.
I would love to hear more about this I was thinking about creating a tapping wizard for the IPS system for people with this ability.
As for the rotary axis DRO... I may create a duplicate screen when I got this finished with 3rd axis support.
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Nice work!
I have noticed that an optional stop button is not available.
This would be nice as well with a indicator led to indicate that it is activated.
Mark
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Nice work!
I have noticed that an optional stop button is not available.
This would be nice as well with a indicator led to indicate that it is activated.
Mark
Look at the last screen shot of cycle I posted... its there.
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Selecting which DRO you'd like to see is fine I think. Don't know though why would someone want the old type DRO - it's either you use the tool table in Mach or not, and if you do you then you have an offset for each tool.
The way I do tapping is by using the spindle as a rotary axis (the SwapAxis command in swaps outputs of spindle and 'A' axis) and then program like this:
G1 Z-10 A10
This will rotate the spindle 10 revolutions and advance the tap 10mm into the workpiece. So this will tap 1mm pitch thread to a depth of 10mm - M6x1 for instance. Then a reverse move to pull the tap out.
An option for a wizard would be entering the pitch and depth and it would calculate the number of turns of the spindle and output the Gcode.
Dan
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Really like the work your doing and this would be something I would be interested in trying out here at our company on one of our cnc lathes that I just retro'd with the machmotion controller...I have over 30 years experience in cnc and can manually program anything but I also use GibbsCam for the more complex geometry jobs to save time for our production requirements on our lathes...I cannot however create a workable screenset for our lathe to save my life so this is where you come in if your interested in me trying out your Beta version.
If interested I will send you the lathes information you requested in your previous post.
Mark
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Selecting which DRO you'd like to see is fine I think. Don't know though why would someone want the old type DRO - it's either you use the tool table in Mach or not, and if you do you then you have an offset for each tool.
I can think of a couple reasons... What if you don't want to upgrade versions or the latest has an issue with your setup? Say you don't change the standard tool number = offset for tool method and just want a quick way to visualize what tool your on? Anyways its now an option (simple check box for "Use new tool offset display") and it has been added. I also added the "T" in front of the tool info no matter what option you choose to display.
What was the first version to include this new DRO so I can make sure I add a note on the screen option setting?
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Sorry cannot see the M01 where bouts is it located on the screen?
Mark
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Mark,
I have been flooded with emails requesting testing. Yours however since it is in a shop work environment especially interests me. Yes please shoot me an email with the specs and I will add you in. Testing should start sometime next week if all goes well.
Wes
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Sorry cannot see the M01 where bouts is it located on the screen?
Mark
Ahh... I thought you meant the stop button. No you are correct that isn't on the screen. But it will be now :)
Keep um coming guys.... this is what turn a good screen into a great one. :)
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Information sent!
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What was the first version to include this new DRO so I can make sure I add a note on the screen option setting?
Mach3 v3.043.038 as per the change log.
Dan
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not sure what you mean i found this version number in the help section for the software
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not sure what you mean i found this version number in the help section for the software
Not sure what you referring too? If its based on Dan's post above yours. We are talking about the Mach version when DRO 246 was introduced.
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Hi,
There is a mach script call to get the mach version - with that you can test at run time to see if you find yourself on a version that has a particular feature implemented or not. See GetMachVersion in the Mach prorammer ref manual.
Dave
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Thanks for the into Dave.
I still am giving people the option but I am also using this check to display a message saying that the new DRO is not available in this version of mach if the version is lower than required. It will then not allow that option to be used. Trying to make this as intuitive as I can.
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Just wanted to give a quick update as I have finished the cycle screen. If you see something that is not there please let me know. Feedback is always welcome.
Features that may not be apparent in the screenshot.
* Jog functions are now smart. They are tuned by a table in the settings tab. Say if you select .0001 and select "Jog Continuous" you will actually move at a realistic rate to be accurate in .0001 increments. As the increments get larger the feed also increases. This also works the same for the MPG. Everything is tunable to your machine.
*Override buttons are smart. They monitor Machs status and will not allow you to cause a crash condition. An example is : You are running a program and press the "Next Tool" button. It will alert you that that function is not possible while the machine is in motion.
*Buttons that will cause machine motion will alert you of what they are about to do and confirm that you want to complete the task. No unwanted moves due to a mistake.
*All toggle buttons will glow with the appropriate indication color when they are activated.
*The top portion of the display is for indication only. You cannot select nor input anything there. They have many smart indicators showing you the different states the control is in. You can however press the "X" and "Z" at the top left corner to home the machine. Once again these are smart buttons that will not allow you to home the machine while it is running a program. They will also ask you before making a move. When the axis is homed they will individually change color. Not homed will be red and homed will be blue.
*"Current Tool" Can use the new or the old version DRO to display the tool number. This option is in the settings tab.
*All control overrides can be set by the buttons or directly editable via the DRO to the right of the buttons.
*The "Next Tool" and "Prev Tool" will change to "Turret FWD" and "Turret REV" when "use turret" is selected in the options tab. Both buttons can be modified for there functions by an external script.
*"CSS Mode" Puts the spindle into constant surface speed mode. This will also change the "Spindle Set RPM" to Spindle Set SFM" in the "Control Overrides box". This button toggles this mode.
*"Wizards" Button will bring up the external wizards dialog
*"Verify Machine" Will send the machine home to verify its position against the home switch and report how far off the machine is.
*"Send Home" Will rapid the machine back to machine zero.
*"Aux Function" Is settable via an external script. This button has the option to glow if you desire to use it as a toggle.
*"Z Face Measure" Sets the Z zero for the current part. Setup all of your tools once. Use this button to move all tools zero you the position the machine is in when you push the button. Just jog the tool to the face of the stock and push "Z Face Measure" and you ready to go.
*"?" at the top right corner will take you to online help for the page (tab) you are on.
*The lower "Tool path" tab will take you to a large tool path view.
*The lower "Dry Run" tab will put you into a fully functional dry run mode with large tool path view. This will allow you to test the code without actually running the machine.
*Current time and date are on all screens. This allows you to still have a clock and get rid of the windows toolbar to gain more screen space.
*There are many more things not listed here. Please let me know what you think.
Wes
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I like it, but I don't find the Block Delete switch. But then again I might be one of the few that use that feature when I program.
This is what I do when I set up a Industrial Turning center: After I had called up the tool offsets for the tool I am using (T0101). I face the part and pull the part and measure it (If I am using a stop, if not the face is set to Z zero or offset the amount I want it to be from the cut point), plug that number in my Tool Offset Screen Z axis DRO and press measure. I do the same with the diameter. I cut the OD and then measure it and that is the number I plug in to my X DRO display and press measure again on the Tool offset page.
I'm just not sure how this is handled in Mach3 and your screens.
Looking forward to putting Your Fine Efforts in this screen to use.
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Ya-Nvr-No,
Here is how its handled...
1)Go to the tooling setup screen. (Settings main tab - Tooling lower tab)
2)Put in some scrap stock.
3)Input the tool number you are setting. (tool one is the master tool and should be capable of facing and turning)
4)Manually face the stock with the jog feature.
5)Press Z measure
6)Jog back to the approximate diameter of your stock.
7)Take a light skim cut on the diameter of the stock and stop the spindle.
8)Measure this diameter and input it into the X set DRO then press enter. This will complete the master tool setup.
9)Insert the next tool and inter in the new tool number.
Jog the tool to the stock using the lowest increment until it just touches the Z face of the stock. You can rotate the spindle by hand to see when it makes contact. After contact back off 1 increment.
10)Press Z measure
11) Do the same for X.
12)Repeat for all of your tools.
Once all of your tools are set all you need to do is set the work offset. For most you can manually face the stock with jog and then press "Z Face Measure" on the cycle screen. You also have the option of using an offset for this in the settings page. This will allow for a go/no go gauge pin if you choose to use it.
Say you break a tool and you need to reset a tool. Or you need to add a tool. You go to the tool setting page, insert tool 1 and press position master tool zero. This will move tool 1 to X and Z zero with zeroed work offsets so you can use it as a stop to position scrap stock to face. Jog the tool out in X until the stock is just past it and clamp it in the chuck. Now manually face it with Jog. Now your ready to set any tool you need using the above method.
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Hi Wes,
For me personally an MDI is a must on every screen. Don't like switching between screens just because I want to change a tool for instance - I have an automatic turret and I must call my custom M6Start macro to change tools. This is just an example, I also use the MDI for all sorts of other stuff like changing the feedrate or switching between G94 and G95 or setting a spindle speed. I don't have a touch screen so it's much faster for me to use the keyboard than reaching for the mouse to click on buttons.
Dan
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Dan,
MDI wont ever be on the cycle screen because its just too dangerous. When your code is running and you input something in the MDI and press enter it will inject it into your running code. Just about everything you said is right there on the cycle screen in the form of a button or DRO. If you need to change feed per rev or feed per min that's something that should be done by editing the G-code. Say your feed is 6 inches per min and you change it to feed per rev. I hope you tool has a big appetite because its gonna have lots to eat quickly. All the overrides are monitored so it would be hard to crash the machine. MDI is for "Manual Data Input" and that is why it is located on the manual screen.
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I have an automatic turret and I must call my custom M6Start macro to change tools.
This is the reason for this feature...
*The "Next Tool" and "Prev Tool" will change to "Turret FWD" and "Turret REV" when "use turret" is selected in the options tab. Both buttons can be modified for there functions by an external script.
You can use any script you want. Just needs to be in my macro directory and named correctly.
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Ya-Nvr-No... Fixed that little issue for you. Block delete has been added. Button glows when it is enabled. :)
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Wes,
Just the way I like it - an MDI on the main screen. Again, it's just easier for me to use the keyboard than grabbing the mouse and looking for the button. I agree though that the screenset perfectly suits a touch-screen.
By the way, I don't switch G94/G95 from the MDI for the loaded program. I do so when I use the MDI for manual turning. And since with your screen, setting the tools seems to be done from the Cycle screen I figured I needed to set the feed mode before programming something like G1 Z-10.
Anyway, just my way of doing things.
Dan
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Thanks Wes on the tool offset setup run thru and the screen update.
Not sure why id have a mist coolant button, guess I would have called them "Coolant" & "User Output" and then have them Glow like you just did with the Block Delete.
Is there a green light to tell me when an axis is home?
"Your the man"!!
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Really nice. This type of screen for lathe was long overdue.
Full feature, crisp, clean, all-in-one, the best.
I hope we are selected for the test.
I have 800 steam pump flanges to make and would really like to run this screen on our lathe.
Question, will all buttons that are active ie. M01, Single block, etc. be highlighted somehow (LED, COLOR CHANGE) when active?
A great piece of work, look forward if selected to try it out.
Mark
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Not sure why id have a mist coolant button, guess I would have called them "Coolant" & "User Output" and then have them Glow like you just did with the Block Delete.
Ya-Nvr-No ,
Many lathes have both flood and mist style coolants. The great part is I will be including quite a few buttons that you can just change the file name on the put them in that spot. They will have an external script that can be modified to your liking. If the button is a toggle of any kind it will indicate with a glow that its on. Even the user modifiable buttons can be toggled with glow indication or standard buttons without a glow. The code to do each will be fully commented in the code. This will allow you to configure it how ever you like.
Wes
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I have 800 steam pump flanges to make and would really like to run this screen on our lathe.
When will you be doing this job? Will you be using cad/cam to create the code? IPS still has a lot to go. I want it perfect before I charge anyone for it.
Question, will all buttons that are active ie. M01, Single block, etc. be highlighted somehow (LED, COLOR CHANGE) when active?
If the button is a toggle (this includes all the ones you listed above and many more) they will glow when ON. This even includes the rapid rate , jog increment etc.
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I came across this doing a search about mist systems. I personally have been turning screws Since 1967 and I hate mist systems. Would not have one, I use a High pressure coolant pump as my secondary coolant output if I need a second source. (Sorry, I just detest seeing that function on any machine) Shows me they have a lot to learn about this business, LOL If I had my druthers I'd setup most all machines with cutting Oil. Lot easier on the machine, doesn't rust, get stale, smell god awful and wont remove paint.
Quote from another source:
After 40 plus years of smoking three packs of Camel's a day I thought my lungs
were immune to anything.
Then I bought what became Express Tool & Die, and "inherited" spray coolant
systems on every machine.
Within a few days I was in severe congestive lung distress. I noticed every one
of my machinists wore masks while machining and IMMEDIATELY had my shop guy
collect all the mist systems and put them in the next scrap run.
I "decreed" that flood coolant would be used in MY SHOP, paid whatever it cost
to set up decent systems, searched for a coolant base that met our requirements
(it costs four times as much as the regular Valcool stuff) I have the Rep come
in every week to test and adjust the mix (free unless I need extra base which is
rare..this stuff holds up beautifully)
The solution is a translucent blue, not an opaque white or pink, the rust
protection on the machines and components is superb.
Coolant is as important to accuracy as the type and grade of tooling and
machines used.
It sure as hell isn't worth the REMOTEST risk to your health!!!
FWIW
end of quote
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I use Gibbscam or manually programing depending on the detail involved in the part obviously easy stuff manual G-code for more involved jobs I use Gibbs.
We just got our licence upgrade Gibbscam 2011.
I have used Gibbs since 1998 on our other equipment we have some of the largest machining centers in the Northeast.
The lathe I want to test your screen on in in the tooling division of our company where we machine the smaller support stuff, in the main bay we have 60" to 200" lathes, and Vtl's that are either CNC or manual
Larry Dyer is my Gibbs guy and he wrote a new post for the Ecoca after I did the Mach3 retro on the lathe.
The flange job should arrive next week, reason being I am on vacation this week so I am sure it will be waiting for me when I get back...you know how that goes...
Check out our website below it shows main bay at my company and also in the scroll pictures there is a stainless spool I just got done with on our Poreba lathe I make about 10 of these Hydro spools a year.
This will give you a visual of our operation and it also lets you know I'm the real deal and your screen will be used in a true manufacturing setting.
Mark
www.energyresourcesgroup.us
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I would be very interested in this screenset for our plastic shop. Our lathe runs basically all day long every day. I would be more than willing to put it through it's paces! We turn everything from very simple parts to fairly complex parts, and this looks like it would be very useful to us.
If not, then hurry up and release it!!! Lol... But really, it looks awesome!
Thanks,
Chris
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And since with your screen, setting the tools seems to be done from the Cycle screen I figured I needed to set the feed mode before programming something like G1 Z-10.
Dan,
The manual screen will have most of the same functions. The biggest difference is it will be geared towards using MDI. It wont have the stuff to load or edit a file. It will however it will have the ability to set up tools directly from that screen as well as play with offsets and a few other things geared to manual operation. On the cycle screen the only thing you can do from the screen directly is set the Z work offset or go to the tool setup screen directly. Basically each screen has a purpose and there shouldn't be a need to be in the incorrect one when it a one button operation to switch between them. You are correct. This screen is geared to be used with a touch screen as I feel a mouse doesn't belong in a shop environment. That doesn't mean you can use one however. :)
Wes
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Chris,
I have had an overwhelming amount of requests to test this. It this time the slots are full. It will be released "soon". I hope I don't sound like Brian too much there? :D I plan to release two versions. One with the conversational programming interface and one without.
Wes
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Absolutely, Wes. Have been planning to replace mine with a touch screen for a l-o-o-n-g time. With your screen I will have a good reason to finally get one :)
Dan
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Another screen just about finished... Once again if you see something not there that you feel should be. Please let me know.
Features on this that may not be obvious...
*Full tool list (tools 1-20) right on the page.
*Tool nose radius button takes to to a diagram screen where you chick on the appropriate tool nose type. Eliminates guess work.
*DROs for using Go/No Go gauge pins when setting tools to the stock. This can be turned on/off with a simple check box so you can leave the values in place when you dont want to use them.
*Full tool configuration from screen including Turret angle for those that use that to position your turret. (Cant be left zero if using an external macro or brain to control the turret)
*Full machine controls including jog, spindle, rapids, feeds, functions, MDI, etc.
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Wes,
It would be nice if the tool list took into account the tool offset as well for the displayed too name. Something like Hood did:
http://www.machsupport.com/forum/index.php/topic,17093.msg116321.html#msg116321
But I don't know how to practically do this for all the combination possible. Instead I hope that in your Tool Setup DRO the displayed tool name is tied to the offset number and not the tool number.
By the way, I think that tool radius compensation doesn't work well in MachTurn. Please correct me if I'm wrong.
Dan
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Wes, just a note from a non-pro CNC lathe user. I know you're spending a lot of time on this (and it shows!), but making tutorial videos on how to utilize the features of this screenset would sell a LOT more of these. Especially to guys like myself who would benefit from all the "extras" in a screen set, but aren't sure how to go about using them.
Good luck to you-
Dave
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I think I need to understand why this tool number vs offset issue is such a big topic? I think it might be due to how people are handling their turret macros. On just about any industrial machine I have ever used that has a tool changer or turret gives you a huge number of tool slots. Now this is how they handle offsets. Basically if you have say a 10 tool changer/ turret. To get to the 2nd set of tool offsets you start at tool 11 and go up to tool 20. Basically tool 11 = slot 1 and so on. Third set of tools would be 21 = slot one. Mach has the capability to do this as well. Why would you ever need to have multiple offsets for the same tool number when they can each have there own offset? Only reason I can think of is the tool changer macro isn't smart enough to handle anything past its physical number of tool slots?? If there is another reason could someone explain it to me? If the tool changer macro if the issue I might be able to help with that as well. Seams like a simple fix.
Wes
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Wes, just a note from a non-pro CNC lathe user. I know you're spending a lot of time on this (and it shows!), but making tutorial videos on how to utilize the features of this screenset would sell a LOT more of these. Especially to guys like myself who would benefit from all the "extras" in a screen set, but aren't sure how to go about using them.
Good luck to you-
Dave
I plan on making some videos as time permits. Right now all of my free time is going into making the screen. This thing is a ton more work than I thought it would ever become. :o I am also planning on doing .html based help files that are accessed directly for the screen you are on and having issues with. I would classify myself as as high end user since I own a machine shop with the real cnc controls. I program them (mostly in cad/cam) set them up and run them every day. This doesn't however mean I know it all. There is always a different way to skin a cat sort of speak. What I am trying to do is bring that level to mach. I started with the lathe side since that was by far lacking the most. Its great to have feedback on this as it helps me to understand other methods. It should create a better product that more users will benefit from.
Dan, if you still wanna do some testing I will send ya a copy and let you play with it. I would love to get this offset issue straightened out.
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I have been thinking about the tool number without matching offset a bit more. Trying to come up with a simple solution for people with turrets. What if I created a way to input the number of tool slots your turret/tool changer has. Tool numbers will be sequential to the slots as I stated above. It will Display the calculated tool slot as well as the tool number and offset. This will allow you to reference the screens DRO for the calculated tool slot in your macro. Maybe you can post the macros you are using.
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Say you going to use one tool to turn and face both sides of a part; (Why use two right?)
there are two ways to setup a machine depending on the controller.
First way you have tool T01 and T02 set up with the same X offset but the Z offset will be the amount you leave for the second side. (Say .060") Now on the first side the finished face is set to zero for T01. After machining the first side and you flip the part now the finished face using T02 on the second side is Z zero. Now in production I can check the tool setup page and assure myself that they are still set at the amount I want to leave. If they are not its time for a refresher training.
The second way is using the same T01 tool but you call up offsets to use such as T0101 or T0102. And they are the same in X but different in Z by .0600"
They both work but on a turret machine or a machine that indexes tool slots, guess what; it indexes so in that case you have to use the second method or you would have to have multiple tool with an offset for each tool. I don't like to have multiple tools of the same unless I am running high production and have a tool management system. (After so many parts it uses the alternate tool)
I'm not big on having ghost numbers (tools that I make up just to get offset)
You could use G10 to grid shift everything but that's not a good way to handle tool setups.
Of course you could work offset for each side. But it is not usually customary to program that way due to operator overload. And on Fanuc controls additional offsets is an option that they make you pay for. (And it is not cheap) Most never buy that option on a turning center, where on a Mill it is part of the package.
Oh ya G10 is an option that has to be bought too. along with background editing which I love.
So it comes down to the type of tool offset package is contingent on how the tools are loaded, turret or flat sliding table.
I prefer the second method because it makes more sense to the operator to call it the same tool, but have different offsets depending on what feature he is machining. Because generally we only let them change wear offsets and limit to relatively small increments. Thus protecting them from moving to far to fast or fat fingers. For the most part I can walk up to any controller and tell looking at that screen the conditions of my inserts. If the wear offsets are less than half of the tool nose radius I know that all is pretty well (depending on the job and tolerances of course), but if I see a number that is high in value, I know something is not right in some way.
Proper tool setup is very critical when you are doing parametric programming using variables. Because it is easy to start changing numbers to get the part back in spec. But as soon as they change parts they are way off based on the variables saved and used the last time that part was made.
Hope that helps.
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OK, this helps visualize it for me. The thing I don't understand is no matter how you do it there will be "ghost tools". The "offset" is really just a tool number that is never used for anything but the offset. Am I correct? If so.. I am going to have to look into modifying the tool table of a non current tool. Basically providing a DRO to input the ghost tool number you want to save the offset to. Like I say wouldn't it be much easier for the guy setting up the machine and the programmer to just specify a tool number and let the CNC machine figure out the rest?
Example...
Turret has 8 slots
Tool is in slot 1
Tool one is for front face so set the tool offsets for tool 1
Now we need to do the back face....
Tool 9 is the turrets physical slot 1 again when called up.
Call up tool 9 and set the offset as tool 9.
This method works for multiple offsets as well as multiple tools such as gang tooling plates.
Screen allows you to input the number of turret slots for your machine in settings. It will then display the physical slot number when a tool number is called. This slot number can be also referenced in the macro to position your turret. I will admit that the industrial machines (mostly Haas machines) run production and we do have a tool library but I couldn't imagine my guys not screwing up if they were given a setup sheet with tool numbers with variable offsets that can be anything.
Let me know your thoughts.
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That's your only option with mach3 unless you can get the powers to be to change the way tool offsets are entered and used.
Unless you do this; T01 and Tool T101 are the same tools: T02 and T102 are the same tools, mach3 has lots of offsets to use. Then it makes logical sense to see that a T101 or T102 is the operation 20 and T01 and T02 is the operation 10. And I don't have to figure out what turret slot i'm using i know its the last two digits. Can not imagine more that 99 tools on a lathe.
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Hmm I gotta think on this one.
As far as not needing to know the slot its in.. you really dont need to care. You just setting up another tool. U push Turret fwd and thats the next tool. The way your doing it is almost the same but there are no checks in place to know what the 2nd offset is. It can be anywhere. This is because T102 is actually tool one using tool 2 offsets. The only way to set offset 2 is to go to tool slot 2 and touch off the tool. But lest say there is already a tool in that slot.. you 1- erase it (knowingly and fixed anything else that uses it) or 2- crash as soon as you call tool two accidentally. I am really not sure how to handle a setup screen for the method you guys are using. How are you doing it right now with a turret?
About the only way I can think of is using a UserDRO for the number of the imaginary tool (what your calling up as an offset) and using SetToolParam to set all the offsets when you touch off the tool. You basically get the turret set to the correct slot using tool number and then enter in the offset you want to set everything to. Maybe I can make 2 different tool setup screens. You will have the option in the settings page to choose the method you want to use.
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Can not imagine more that 99 tools on a lathe
Its not hard with specialty forming tools, broaches, taps, drills, multi point thread formers.. the list goes on and on.
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Hi Wes,
Now this is how they handle offsets. Basically if you have say a 10 tool changer/ turret. To get to the 2nd set of tool offsets you start at tool 11 and go up to tool 20. Basically tool 11 = slot 1 and so on.
In this example it's very easy to figure what slot would be tool number 36 for instance. But what if your turret had 6 slots for instance (like in my case), it would make it fairly complex to figure what slot is tool number 15... well at least for me ;) Now it's true that normally you wouldn't care about the actual slot, but I am just throwing in a thought.
Only reason I can think of is the tool changer macro isn't smart enough to handle anything past its physical number of tool slots??
Exactly!!! This is the main reason! I don't know how to change my macro to do what you say. May be your way may be better than the way I currently work, but the macro needs to change and I will have to get used to it. And by the way, I've never seen an industrial machine that works like you describe. Those I've seen work in terms of tool slots and offset numbers.
I still think that if you make the tool description in the Tool Setup DRO tied to the offset number (OEM DRO 245) this would make both camps happy. It wouldn't interfere with the way you work since in your case the offset number is always identical to the tool number.
Dan, if you still wanna do some testing I will send ya a copy and let you play with it. I would love to get this offset issue straightened out.
Sure.
Dan
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Guess you are not following me:
There are 253 tools available in the setup page
T01 is tool 1 with its setup data for the first side
T101 is still tool 1 with its own setup data that is the ghost tool for the second side.
T201 is still tool 1 with another set of offsets, (I have no reason to think this functional unless I have a third side to turn)
T53
T153
T253
And I don't know of a lathe that you don't have to set up for every job you put in it, who can leave or use 99 tools in any lathe?
Whenever you setup for a new job you have to qualify your tool positions. Or you are looking for a crash.
You don't set up Tools offline like you do Mill tools in a qualified holder that has a gauge line to work from.
You physically have to put the tools in the machine and touch them off.
I'd love to see a picture of a lathe that has more than 99 tools. I've never even seen a controller with that many tools available (offsets yes T0101 thru T0199).
Mach3 is the first for me but it is a controller with milling / routing in mind first. The lathe thing was an after thought and it is obvious that the tool tables were never addressed for turning centers. Now we just have to be creative and use them functionally.
You should not use Mach3 Tool offset page for your Tool setup sheet. Just because you have all these available doesn't mean you should just fill them all in. There is a systematic approach to setting up a new job. Don't clutter up the Tables with numbers that you wont relate to in 6 months. Create a Job sheet with all data that is needed, then fill in the controller with only that. Clear out the rest because it will be useless anyways. Never setup a job with anymore than it takes to get the job done and others can follow your logic.
KISS (keep it simple stu...)
Now you just have to figure out how to parse the number to call up the last two digits in the T number to get the right position on your turret. Should be able to do that using a VB script in your tool change macro. Also a check in the script to be aware that sometimes people forget and only use one number instead of two (T1 = T01) so it would need to check for that possibility.
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T201 is still tool 1 with another set of offsets, (I have no reason to think this functional unless I have a third side to turn)
To me it looks like tool number 2 with offset number 1 ;)
Dan
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Not in mach3 it is tool 201
Look at the tool sheet they don't have separate offsets and tools, it all one call up.
This is a very unique controller don't confuse this with industrial controllers tool offset systems.
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Sorry but I don't follow. Read the manual, section 7.5.3.
Dan
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See what I mean about being confusing? ;D
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OK.. making some changes... Gonna make you guys happy for now. ;D I will also add the offset DRO to the control overrides.
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sorry don't have the manual handy.
If that is true, Then I don't understand the 253 tool table then.
So you can have a T25301 and a T25302 and a T25303 ???
Where do I put in the tool and wear offsets for each of them?
Sorry i don't follow then.
Unless we are looking at two different tool sheets.
My version I get one Geometry and Wear offset per tool.
Version R3.043.039
write a small program and fill in the tool table with some know values and then call the tools up using single block and step thru the program and watch the DRO and see how they are updated.
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You can only use 99 tools in Mach3Turn. Well, unless it hasn't changed recently... ;)
Dan
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either way (has or hasn't), where do you put it in?
T0101 T0102 T0103 offsets I still only see one per tool, I opened the machturn program, go to Tool Table, change tool 253 and then go to Tool Table Editor and see it has changed tool 253.
I find only one offset per tool. and find nothing other than Tool 1 thru Tool 253
Seems pretty straight forward to me.
Your going to have to explain it better to me. Winking at me is not working for me to understand where your coming from, LOL
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Mach Turns tool call is Txxyy where xx is tool number and yy is the offset so you can only have a max of 99 tools and 99 offsets as you can not call any more than two digits for tool and two for offset.
Hood
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Ya-Nvr-No , where do you put what in??? The offset your calling? Its just the tool number that your calling. Basically say its T803. The 8 is the the physical tool shot your using (what the turret indexes to). The 3 means use tool 3's offsets instead of tool 8's. So to set the secondary offset your using you go to tool 3 and pug the info in. Biggest issue with this is tracking everything. If your relying on offset 3 for tool 8 then forget and write over it setting up another tool... you will have big problems. Sounds like a recipe for disaster to me.
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Thanks Hood and I read that but I dont follow the screens that pop up that go with the machturn program. Where do I find this multiple offset page?
Why do I see 253 tools and one set of offsets to go with each tool?
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Mill has 253 tools and originally Turn did, I believe, as I think the tool call format in Turn used to be the same as Mill in that you called a tool then a separate offset call. That will be why the table still shows the 253 offsets.
Hood
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Where do I find this multiple offset page?
There isn't one. There are 99 tools that have one offset per each. Your just able to mix and match them.
Why do I see 253 tools and one set of offsets to go with each tool?
253 is because Brian hasn't updated the turn side to reflect the 99 tool limitation.
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Thanks for the insight! Well isn't that a odd thing. Hope Brian has fixed that in Mach4
So its back to my original post about the second way to do it with a twist.
Tool 0101 is for Op 10 and tool 0151 is for Op 20
Tool 0202 is for Op 10 and tool 0252 is for Op 20
now your limited to the number of tools minus the number of offsets used.
99 - 4 = 95 more available
thanks for my lesson of the day about mach3.
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Biggest thing to remember is you have 99 offsets. Offsets = tools... So its quite simple. Like I said before. The best way to implement something like this is to make a better turret macro. For a 6 position turret you have 16 sets of tools possible. Tool 1 and tool 7 and 13 and 19 ... are all slot one. Quite easy to keep track of (I can even make a DRO that shows this info but when you use the setup sheet and call up say tool 7 and its the same tool as 1 called for just a different touch off point it will be obvious.). When you call up tool 7 you can set the offset to the same tool in that slot. Say you have a turret with index-able holders... well you can put tools in and out and not loose the settings. Create a tool library. Tools always match the offset and there is no head scratching coupled with hair loss.
Dan, Post your macro you are using and I will see what I can do to make it work the way I am telling you. You can try it and tell me if you think that the way to go or not.
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Wes,
Here is my macro:
numtools = 6 'this is the number of turret positions
newtool = GetSelectedTool( )
thistool = GetOEMDRO(1000) 'current tool DRO
While(thistool < 1 Or thistool > numtools)
thistool = question("Please enter the current tool")
Wend
SetOEMDRO 1000,newtool
If(newtool <> thistool And newtool > 0 And newtool <= numtools) Then
ActivateSignal( OUTPUT2)
While(IsMoving( ))
Sleep(40)
Wend
While(thistool <> newtool)
thistool = thistool +1
If (thistool > 6) Then thistool =1
While(Not IsActive(INPUT1) ) 'wait for switch to open
Wend
While(IsActive( INPUT1)) 'wait for switch to close
Wend
Wend
DeActivateSignal( OUTPUT2)
While(IsMoving( ))
Sleep(40)
Wend
End If
SetCurrentTool( newtool)
Sleep(13)
The turret rotates in one direction. The While loop counts the signals returned on INPUT1 and then OUTPUT2 deactivates and the turret reverses and locks.
Dan
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I am thinking this may be a good way to go, previously I had the tools on my two 6 pos turrets numbered 1 to 12 and I used the offsets in groups, 1 to 12, 13 to 24, 25 to 36 etc but my CAM is a pain because of that as it only allows a tool number once so I need to make up tool tables for each part if I am using non standard tools, this way would mean I could make up a full table in CAM.
Hood
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Dan,
I have to head into work. I will look at this later and get it working for you. I will send you my current screen set version to play with. Would love to hear some feedback on it.
Wes
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Great, Wes. Would be nice if you could make the macro work.
Thanks,
Dan
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No prob
Wes
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Yes, it is, Wes. A Txxyy will call it. By default Mach3Turn executes the M6Start macro upon encountering a Txxyy command.
Dan
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Sorry, was too quick to answer ;D it didn't show you edited the message...
Dan
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I did some testing and the 253 offsets do work and are called up correctly, so you could program like I thought earlier. Interesting that the system is that robust. Gives you Lots of tools, just an odder way to call them up.
Did notice that the "Direction" DRO does not work correctly in machturn screen but it does update the tool sheet, just does not show correctly.
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wes i would like to test your program
please send me a copy of everything i would need
I have a hobby cnc lathe and mill
I use them everyday
thanks JuMpS4
the pics are of a model I have been working on ( Yulee Sugar Mill ), the roller mill is the only parts i have used cnc on
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I did some testing and the 253 offsets do work and are called up correctly, so you could program like I thought earlier. Interesting that the system is that robust. Gives you Lots of tools, just an odder way to call them up.
Did notice that the "Direction" DRO does not work correctly in machturn screen but it does update the tool sheet, just does not show correctly.
How do you call tools greater than tool 99 or offset 99?
Hood
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I can confirm it does work, but I'm not sure how to call it from G-Code. Inputting 253 into the tool number DRO applies the offsets though.
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Not much use if you cant call from code and as far as I know the format in turn for calling a tool is TXXYY so max 99 tool number max 99 offset number For example call T01222 for tool 1 offset 222 and what you will actually get is tool 12 offset 22.
Hood
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Hood, Your right it can not be done from calling it up in the program. Too bad!
I did it with MDI and also typing in the tool number in the tool dro input box.
They could change it back, LOL lot more offsets to use then.
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Personally I would say no way to going back to the M6 tool call and separate offset call (I think thats how it was done anyway ) If it was possible to add the tool call as TXXYYY then maybe but I think that would be problematic as at the moment you can call t101 or t0101 and its the same but if you added an extra option for the offset to go above 99 then you would have to conform exactly to the format I think so it would have to be T01001 as the call . This would be a PITA for people with code already made as it would mean every code would have to be checked and edited.
I am certainly happy with 99 offsets and dont need any more ;D
Hood
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;D Me too, I was just being that PITA ::)
I would be happier if all the extra Tools were removed and have a tool table that reflects the true table of tools and offset available.
I'm sure Wes is on the road to helping this issue get resolved. But for the others that don't or can't buy his screens I hope Mach4 is the fix.
Thanks again for getting me up to speed on machturn's issues.
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I'm sure Wes is on the road to helping this issue get resolved. But for the others that don't or can't buy his screens I hope Mach4 is the fix.
Guys I am going to be releasing 2 versions. One will be everything but the conversational programming interface. The other will be with it. The pricing I have in plan so far is $25 for just the screen and $65 for all the version with the conversational programming. I may offer customization at a fee. Updates and fixes will be free. This will give people who only use CAD/CAM a cheaper option to have this screen. If sales do well on this I will be making a screen for mill next.
Dan, I haven't had any time yet to play with your turret macro. I should have some time tomorrow so maybe I can get you something whipped up to try.
Wes
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But for the others that don't or can't buy his screens I hope Mach4 is the fix.
It is certainly on the list that I keep telling Brian that needs fixed in Turn but so far there has not really been any work done on Turn Rev4 as Brian says he needs to get Mill done first before he can do Turn. I keep telling him, Tongue in cheek, that Turn should for once get priority ;D
Regarding the m6start macro I have managed to do mine so that the slot position can be 1 to 99 and it seems to be working well here in simulation so will get it tested out tomorrow (Formula 1 on today so no workshop :) )As usual with me being crap at VB its long winded and I am sure there is a way to make it look prettier but as long as it works thats all that matter ;D
As far as Mach is concerned I see no benefit to doing it that way but it will certainly be better for my CAM as it will allow me to set up a master tool table :)
Hood
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No worries, Wes. Have edited it myself and tested. Works as expected :)
numtools = 99 'this is the number of turret positions
newtool = GetSelectedTool( ) 'new requested tool
thistool = GetOEMDRO(1000) 'current tool DRO
While(thistool < 1 Or thistool > numtools)
thistool = question("Please enter the current tool")
Wend
SetOEMDRO 1000,newtool
current_slot_num = thistool Mod 6
If (current_slot_num =0) Then current_tool_slot = 6
new_slot_num = newtool Mod 6 'new requested turret slot number
If (new_slot_num = 0) Then new_slot_num = 6
If(new_slot_num<> current_slot_num And newtool > 0 And newtool <= numtools) Then
ActivateSignal( OUTPUT2)
While(IsMoving( ))
Sleep(40)
Wend
While(current_slot_num <> new_slot_num)
current_slot_num = current_slot_num +1
If (current_slot_num > 6) Then current_slot_num = 1
While(Not IsActive(INPUT1) ) 'wait for switch to open
Wend
While(IsActive( INPUT1)) 'wait for switch to close
Wend
Wend
DeActivateSignal( OUTPUT2)
While(IsMoving( ))
Sleep(40)
Wend
End If
SetCurrentTool( newtool)
Sleep(13)
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Dan,
Mod, thats the short cut I was needing, I have made mine much neater now.
Thanks, even though you didnt know you had helped ;D
Hood
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Ah... no problem, Hood ;D
Anyhow, you're good in VB if you managed to make it work without "Mod" :)
Dan
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Glad you got it working Dan. :)
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Anyhow, you're good in VB if you managed to make it work without "Mod" :)
Dan
Exactly the opposite as I have now done in a few lines what I needed about 100 for before ;D
Hood
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Had a job today which reminded me why I needed to use different offsets for same tool. I have a gang tooling plate which I sometimes mount and use in conjunction with the turret. Use this mainly for high volume jobs where every second matters to avoid wasting time on the turret indexing. So one tool is used from the turret and another two are from the gang tooling plate. In this instance the 3 tools are:
T0404
T0441
T0442
Since the tool is the same the turret doesn't rotate and allows only changing the offset for each tool.
Dan
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In all screens I will be giving the option to set both the tool number and the offset. This will allow you to do whatever method you desire. If the offset is 0 it will be set the same as the tool. this should make everyone happy. :)
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Sounds like a Mach3 reach around, LOL, cool!!! good job
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Had a job today which reminded me why I needed to use different offsets for same tool. I have a gang tooling plate which I sometimes mount and use in conjunction with the turret. Use this mainly for high volume jobs where every second matters to avoid wasting time on the turret indexing. So one tool is used from the turret and another two are from the gang tooling plate. In this instance the 3 tools are:
T0404
T0441
T0442
Since the tool is the same the turret doesn't rotate and allows only changing the offset for each tool.
Dan
Dan, the good thing for me is I had previously adhered to the offset and slot numbers I used so now even old code doesnt need editing as the macro sees T01 the same as T13 or T25 or... so I can happily use new tool numbering whilst at the same time can safely use old code without needing to edit :)
As said no benefit to me with Mach itself but for Dolphin CAM it will make my life easier so I am glad this subject was brought up :)
Hood
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Oh... Thanks Hood. It didn't come to my mind. So I can program T0404 for the turret and T1010 for the gang tool and the turret won't rotate.
Dan
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In all screens I will be giving the option to set both the tool number and the offset. This will allow you to do whatever method you desire. If the offset is 0 it will be set the same as the tool. this should make everyone happy. :)
Wes,
As I previously said, just make sure the name of the tool is tied to the offset number (yy in Txxyy). I think it wouldn't affect the new tol numbering while it would be beneficial for the old one.
Dan
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As I previously said, just make sure the name of the tool is tied to the offset number (yy in Txxyy). I think it wouldn't affect the new tol numbering while it would be beneficial for the old one.
Name of the tool always reflects the offset in mach. Tool number just calls up the slot of your turret. Offset is the one that sets up everything else. I am adding the tool number so if your macro is smart enough to detect the change of the tool dro without actually calling a tool change you can index to that position. Just adds more options is all. Options is the name of the game to please as many people as you can. :)
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Name of the tool always reflects the offset in mach. Tool number just calls up the slot of your turret. Offset is the one that sets up everything else. I am adding the tool number so if your macro is smart enough to detect the change of the tool dro without actually calling a tool change you can index to that position. Just adds more options is all. Options is the name of the game to please as many people as you can. :)
That is only the case in the most recent versions of Mach, unless you are managing to do it yourself somehow? Up until very recently the tool number was what everything was tied to, with the way myself and Dan are doing the macro now it wouldnt matter, but before, it did.
Brian got fed up with my constant nagging and he gave in and did a couple of small changes, hope he caves in and does some more, CSS would be nice :) Likely that wont happen until the next Rev though and no one knows when that will be, not even Brian I suspect.
Hood
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Name of the tool always reflects the offset in mach. Tool number just calls up the slot of your turret. Offset is the one that sets up everything else. I am adding the tool number so if your macro is smart enough to detect the change of the tool dro without actually calling a tool change you can index to that position. Just adds more options is all. Options is the name of the game to please as many people as you can. :)
That is only the case in the most recent versions of Mach, unless you are managing to do it yourself somehow? Up until very recently the tool number was what everything was tied to, with the way myself and Dan are doing the macro now it wouldnt matter, but before, it did.
Brian got fed up with my constant nagging and he gave in and did a couple of small changes, hope he caves in and does some more, CSS would be nice :) Likely that wont happen until the next Rev though and no one knows when that will be, not even Brian I suspect.
Hood
Hmm it may just be me but when I use DRO 245 to set the offset (tool stays the same) it loads all the current info for the tool number of that offset. Seams to save it as well. Maybe you can check that on your setup Hood? I am using Mach3 version R3.043.046
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By "recently", Hood was meaning the recent addition of DRO 245. Up until recently this DRO was not implemented.
Dan
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By "recently", Hood was meaning the recent addition of DRO 245. Up until recently this DRO was not implemented.
Dan
Ahh... hard to keep up sometimes. :) Anyways... I haven't noticed any issues that are specific to the latest version. Threading seams to work. Is there anything I should be aware of or any reason not to use this version?
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Not that I am aware of, but often people have a stable setup and are just not willing to take the chance involved in upgrading to a new version (which makes sense to me).
Dan
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Latest version works fine for me also.
What I was meaning was up until Brian made these changes if you called T0101 the tool data such as name, wear etc would be correct but if you called T0110 it would not as Mach was looking at the tool number part of the call for the info rather than the offset part. The changelog should give the version/date it was done.
Hood
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Not that I am aware of, but often people have a stable setup and are just not willing to take the chance involved in upgrading to a new version (which makes sense to me).
Dan
Makes sense to me. I was forever stuck on an older version because of threading issues. I knew it worked and had no real reason to try to break it by upgrading. The problem is there are many features that make it a requirement at this point to use my screen. The new DROs are a small part of that. External compiled scripting is the big reason. I certainly hope there are no issues as it will kill this project in a hurry.
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The changelog should give the version/date it was done.
May 27/2011
3.043.038
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Hi DaONE,
I would very much like to purchase your screen set, What do you estimate the selling price to be?
I would need a fairly stable version by December this year to use on a Mori Lathe retrofit that I am busy with at the moment.
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I have posted pricing in the thread. As I stated nothing is set in stone until this is finished. This is a best guess at this point of the project. I have talked with a member on this forum about the possibility of putting everything in a plugin. This may make the date pushed back a bit further. Like I say nothing is set in stone. What I can say is that I have been putting every free minute I have into this striving to get it finished. I certainly hope to have it ready by December. :)
A couple of new features that were added are...
1)Full line by line g-code commenting option (Optional settings check box) for all IPS operations. (shows what each line does for people who are not familiar with G-code)
2)Optional spindle stop between operations in IPS.
3)CSS Max spindle speed settings.
4)Tool number + Offset selection throughout the screens and IPS system.
5)Seamless on the fly switching between Metric and Imperial units complete with indication throughout. Working units and IPS are individually settable. This also includes jogging units and speeds.
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I am hoping to get the screen set ready for a release the first of next week. Tweaking a few things , finishing the interactive help and getting a website ready. The initial version will not include the IPS system. That will be able to be purchased separately when finished. All other features other than IPS will be included. Pricing will be set at $25 for the screen. Updates will be free. I will provide more information soon.
Wes
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;D ;D ;D ;D Great News, I cant wait to try it out. ;D ;D ;D ;D
Will you accept Paypal?
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Yes PayPal will be the method of payment.
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Just chiming in , very nice work Dan
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Thanks, but aside from some critics I haven't done much... It's Wes who you wanted to address the compliment to ;)
Dan
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Thanks Dan :)
Just a quick update. I know I said I was releasing this on Monday. I decided to add a few more things as well as I found a couple of bugs. I want it the best it can be before releasing this into the wild. Hope you guys understand.
I added a full diagnostics page. I also added full axis calibration that works like the one mill versions have had. Basically you tell it how far to move and then how far it moved (measured) and it with set your units. Each axis is independent. This should really help people with setup.
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DaONe,
Will be a nice addition for the lathe users when it is released and look forward to trying it out.
Got all the wizards done also?
RICH
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Wizards (IPS) are not done yet. Very time consuming. They also need to be thoroughly tested. I will be releasing a screen without them first. I will have an upgrade path for people who want the IPS system when its available. More than half of them are complete.
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Hi Wes,
Something I had forgotten to mention before I started this run of parts - would you consider adding a parts counter DRO? Should be fairly simple and you already have a macropump anyway so will only have to look at the Cycle button being activated and count it.
Another thing which may not be that simple is a total elapsed time DRO (from the moment Mach loads). It has to be zero-able. Together with the part counter it can be a very valuable tool for high volume runs.
Dan
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For the parts counter you (I think) can use Fanuc style parts counting macros in the g-code. I will run some tests and post results. The "Loop" DRO would become the parts counter.
Full elapse time I really cant do in a standard screenset. Timing issues would be a big problem. Flash would take care of that but it would be far off if I decide to go into doing a flash screen.
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My apolagies - great app Wes really looking fwd to this one since I just finished my Taig CNC twins
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wow this looks VERY nice, great work. im def in for it
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Guys I have been hesitant to release anything as I just don't have the time for support. Been dealing with family health problems. My brother (age 32) may have cancer and its been consuming most of my mental capacity. I have it ready just no way to support it.
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just release it with the understanding from people that their may not be much or any at all support
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I am in Agreement, Release the software.
Support via this forum will be adequate for most people. As long as you inform people of the fact that there will be limited support,I can't see anyone complaining.
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I am in Agreement, Release the software, and let the support come from the forum here.
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Whatever happened here? I got lost. New to lathe and was looking for better screenset or wizards. Found this and it appears to have just stopped after DaOne said it was ready but he had issues with support. Is that the end of it?
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Guys I have not dropped the ball on this. Just been very very busy. I am in talks with Andrew at Machmotion on this. I have been thinking about releasing the screen itself for a small fee because I have has so many requests its overwhelming.
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So if the plan was screenset and IPS wizards or whatever they are, will these two run separately from one another? In other words, will I be able to buy the IPS Wizard part without the screenset?
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I will be selling the screenset with a few common IPS wizards (OD Turn, Face, OD Threading) The IPS wizards are basically going to be free and a taste of whats coming. I cant really reveal any more information at this time but it will be even better than it currently is. :) Selling this now is for those who cant wait and really want the screen. I cant tell you how many emails I get asking when this will be ready. You can still run all standard wizards with the screen. This will give you a professional look.
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Please guys if you have any questions or would like to purchase the screenset please send you emails to machipslathe@gmail.com. My PM box keeps filling up and its getting hard to keep track of emails.
Some questions I keep getting asked are...
Q)Does it support touch screen?
A)Yes
Q) When will this version be released?
A) 2/1/2012 as long as everything goes as planned.
Q)What will this version cost?
A)It will be $40 for the new screen with 3 IPS wizards.
Q)Is there an installer?
A)Yes
Q)What resolution was this screen designed for?
A)1024X768
Q)Do all the tabs work?
A)Yes however you are limited in IPS to OD Turn, OD Threading and Facing
Q) does this replace the original lathe screen or is it a wizard?
A)Replaces the original lathe screen.
Q)Can I still use all the current wizards?
A)Yes
Q) Will it work with a custom turret macro?
A)Yes it allows you to use any macro you want for the tool change function.
Thanks guys,
Wes
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Been a couple weeks again, have you started selling this and if so, how much and what's included in the original release? Plans for more wizards still in the works?
Tom
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Been nearly two months since any news, there was a reference to talks with machmotion, so maybe he decided to sell the screenset to them???
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Sorry guys I run a business. This isnt what pays the bills. Its more less a hobby. I have also been dealing with family health issues. I have had very little time. I decided not to release/sell it until I have time to finish documentation so I don't get bombarded by questions I dont have time to answer. I am one person and am spread way too thin. I can say things have been done and it is closer but I hate to give dates and miss them.
Wes
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Thanks for the update, Wes. Hope things go well for you and things look up!!
Tom
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I decided not to release/sell it until I have time to finish documentation so I don't get bombarded by questions I dont have time to answer.
Since I sell a Mach3 screen, I can tell you that 99% of the questions I get are answered in the manual I provide. The ones that ask the questions, don't read the manual. :)
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Does anyone know if this project is still alive?
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Well its alive on my lathe. My kid loves it. Due to the fact that I don't have access to the mach4 (and I hear everything will be changing) beta program nor much interest I stopped working on it.
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Too bad you got the feeling there was not much interest, Wes :( I was still waiting for the finished version.
Dan
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Yep, me too, just thought you were busy with other things and health issues, which I hope you're feeling better?
Dave
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I was also awaiting the finished product for purchase....
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Well if there is still interest then I will pick the project back up. Anyone know what it would take to become a beta tester for Mach4? I really would like to make this work on future versions as well. As far as the health issues. That was my brother. He was diagnosed with cancer and I am happy to say they tell him he is cured. :)
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Glad for you brother :)
As to beta testing, I think you will have to contact Brian directly. He mentioned on the Yahoo group some time ago that beta phase is close, but I don't think they got there yet.
Dan
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Glad your brother is doing good. :)
Brett
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Well if there is still interest then I will pick the project back up. Anyone know what it would take to become a beta tester for Mach4? I really would like to make this work on future versions as well. As far as the health issues. That was my brother. He was diagnosed with cancer and I am happy to say they tell him he is cured. :)
Excellent, great for your brother AND for you ;)
Dave
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It's always great when someone beats that disease ...glad to hear it :) As for the screen, I swear every time I turn on my Emco 120p, I can hear it whisper to me .."please finish that great screen, Wes" ;D
pete
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"Well if there is still interest then I will pick the project back up"
This I think was your last post Wes. There is, even now a fair bit of interest in this screenset.....
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:)
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Sorry guys been too swamped to even mess with this stuff. Anyone here able to write macros and such that they would like to continue the project as a joint effort? All the building blocks are in place and I feel all the framework is in place. I am just way too time limited to do this on my own. I was hoping to get some time to work on this but hobbies have to take a back seat to putting food on the table. Please let me know those of you who might be interested.
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Hi Wes, thanks for the update.
I will have a bit of time in about 6 weeks or so. When I return from a long awaited holiday. I am keen to work alongside you and continue your good work, since the concept impressed me greatly at the time. I will send you a message when I get back.
Cheers
Dave
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Anyone here able to write macros and such that they would like to continue the project as a joint effort?
And then what, sell it?
RICH
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Well here is the issue at hand. I was hoping to make a little $ for the massive amount of time I put into this. To be honest I thought about just releasing it as a screenset for a few bucks without the IPS system as it is for the most part done. Instead of going this route maybe I will just post all the files here and let others continue the project on the fact that if they like it and feel it was worth something they could send me some beer $ :) as well as post the updates they have made. I really wish I had the time to finish it but I just don't see that happening any time soon. My inbox fills up constantly with questions on this project and I feel its a waste to just let it sit since there seams to be allot of interest. Let me know your thoughts.
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Been a few years since the start of it, but, an unfinished screen set without some new interface and additions dosen't seem to make sense paying for it.
Just my honest thoughts so don't take it personal. If your going to charge for it then it has to be worth it to the user.
The original intent, way back whenever, was to provide an improved screen set for the lathe. That effort went by the way side and then you chose to
to go on your owne. As you know it takes a lot of work and time.
If it is yours then you get all that goes with it. If you share it, maybe it will develop more, maybe it will die....hard to tell.
As far as myself, I purchased Dolphin for the lathe after waiting years for something to come about and still use a slightly modfied screen set.
RICH
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Not sure if there is still interest in this project or not since Mach4 is right around the corner (then again it was in 2011 as well)? I have moved on to LinuxCNC for good so completing this screenset on my watch is not gonna happen. I still get many emails and private messages asking about this so I figure the best way to handle it is to release it into the wild "as is" for others to build off of. All I ask is you attach my name to the credits if you re-release it, it to be kept public domain (do not charge for my work) and finally if you do make something of it please drop me a line on your progress. I am attaching the last installer I made as well as all the decrypted scripts.
-Wes Treihaft
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Wes, That is very generous of you, Thank you
Had to go back and reread this Thread as it has been so long and my memory failed me. ::)
Hope to modify and use for my present need, as I have just built a new 4 axis turning center.
But on opening the lset, noticed that some support files are flagged as missing. Installer missed them maybe?
Very sweet, tremendous amount of work you put in to this fine project.
thanks again ;D
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They were most likely never fully removed and just used as placeholders. Never the less here they are...
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Just a bit of info. This installer should work perfectly if you want to have a look at the screen. Just install it and then in the mach3 loader select the "Mach3 IPS Turn" profile. The included macro files are only needed if you need to modify the screen set. As far as i remember the screen itself works perfectly however the IPS stuff needed to be finished. If anyone needs to contact me (or buy me a beer (paypal) for my work ;D) you can do so at xgenmods@gmail.com. Hope others find a use for this as I put many hours into it. I wish Mach3 was a bit better on the lathe side to keep me here but I don't see that happening anytime soon.
-Wes
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Rich, and other Lathe users........
We had started a community based screen set a while back, When Da-One was showing his stuff, it was very good.
We had even talked of collaborating..... But, at that time my time was very limited and so was his..........
I don't mind trying to do a "Community" screen, but, the issue then, and historically, is when you ask users what they want, response is poor........ they are FAST at pointing out things they don't like, but offer no solutions or even help.
There is A LOT of work, that goes into a comprehensive screen set, most of it, it (for me at least), designing all the custom bit maps, and making screen pages that are practical without a lot of "Skiddle Puke" on it......
I am going to start another thread under, the Works in progress, heading under screen design.
Please go to that thread, and see the questions and see if this is something the lathe users want to do....... I will be glad to help, but..... there is all kinds of talent and mature mach users on this site now. There are guys that do good screen work, and/or macros, etc......
Scott
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Scott.. did you see post #169? That should be a good start. :)
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I know old post loaded this wow clean wish the IPS was Complete anyone do any work with this or know a screen set that has an IPS?
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I know old post loaded this wow clean wish the IPS was Complete anyone do any work with this or know a screen set that has an IPS?
I have two lathes that say the same thing :)
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I don't know of any that has an IPS.
Mach4 will have additional Gcodes to do basics when done.
In the meantime use ( and not necesssarily in the order given):
NFS Lathe Wizard, use other wizards currently available, hand program, use some available Macro's folks have done, use Lazyturn,
or buy a CAM program for the lathe.
RICH